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Ok,I need your expertise right now!! A long time 240 fan but with a new arrival of a baby, I have been entertaining the idea of owning a newer wagon. I came across with a '97 855 T5 with 200K. It needs brake work and check engine light is on. Other than that, I did not notice anything that may need immediate attention. He is asking $2500. I left him a phone message saying it is more than we can afford. Then he is called me saying he is willing to work with me. I need to call him back tonight...how much does something like this worth? I am thinking with the brakes and O2 sensors (I am assuming...)that's already roughly $4-500. Woudl it be faire to offer $1500? Thoughts, folks? Thank you!!
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I drove 240's for 10 years, then bought a used 850 turbo. To be blunt, it is a money pit. Way harder to DIY, more stuff to go wrong, higher priced parts etc.
I would rather dump $5k into a good 240 than 3k into an 850. Just my 2 cents.
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Thank you. I am actually leaning more towards putting more $$$ into my '82. It is already a very reliable and I "know" the car well. The question really is how safe, reliable and comfortable would it be (for the baby)comparing to newer bricks, even after I make my 240 a "perfect" runner. I am truly torn. I love, I mean LOVE my 240. But with a baby of my own makes my perspective bend a bit, if I you know what I mean...
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With limited funds and a new born, there is no rush to get a 'new' car. The car seat goes in the back seat, and the baby will not know what kind of car it is.
The newer cars have metal clips designed for the new car seats, much better than trying to use a sholder/lap belt. When I was a kid, seat belts weren't even invented yet. We survived. Just keep under 12 children in the rear.
You will eventually want ABS and traction control, along with curtain air bags and an air bag for your front seat passenger. So, save up your money and buy as new as you can.
Remember, any newer car you get will cost you an additional $1,000 to get it reliable. Newer cars are harder to fix, the parts are more expensive, and there are more computers and fuses. But, newer equates to safer driving.
Besides, you might want a 2004 V70 to carry all of the kid stuff :)
Klaus
--
Cynthia Amendt, RIP
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davidjudd2 is correct but forgetting some important things too.
Depending on how well the particular car you're looking at has been cared for, you could well be in for a good deal of work/money/both.
With that said, I don't think I would characterize these cars (some call the 93 850 - 2000 S/V70 the P1 cars) as 'way harder' to DIY. There's more equipment, so I guess that leads to /more/ DIYing, and some of that equipment certainly has less than stellar longevity. But for most things, the lifespan is at least reasonable - it just so happens you're looking at buying a used one which means more things will be coming up then if it were new.
Also though, they really are a better car in most ways you can measure. The ride is better, they're quieter, they have more power and usually better fuel economy. The engines are quiet and smooth (if your engine mounts haven't died!) and they have great safety features like ABS and a (though somewhat simple) traction control system, and a much MUCH stronger and safer chassis. Not to mention the WHIPS seat system and the airbags (1995+ models have side impact bags in the seats too - a first in the world I think!).
About the only thing I can say I miss from the old RWD cars is the RWD (feels nice on the road), the lack of squeaks/rattles (these new cars have more to be sure), and the turning circle (which is admittedly pretty stellar in the 2/7/900s and maybe not a fair comparison).
Now going over all that, with a new baby on the way I would be pretty much only concerned with two things: safety and reliability.
The more safety for mom and the baby the better.
Reliability to me means no worries of breaking down anywhere ever, esp when you won't be in the car to rig it up to get home. A stranded wife (and baby!) sucks sucks SUCKS! Also, you are going to be stressed an tired from all the 'new baby' stuff and won't want to be stuck laying under your car all night.
With those two things in mind it's pretty tough to beat a Honda... if only the were selling that euro Accord wagon eh?
These cars are pretty safe esp for their vintage. And they're perfectly capable of being reliable, but it takes some patience and time and money. And if you can't DIY it takes mucho money. I would count on about 2 years of slowly picking away at things to bring the reliability all the way to where you want it, and probably around $1000 - $1500 in parts.
I have to say though, if it were me, I'd be looking for something with 'stability control' which with Volvo started with 2001. And generally on this board 2001s are considered bad news, so really 2002 or preferably 2003, with DSTC.
--
1998 V70 AWD->FWD Turbo 200k+
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There is no doubt that 850/V70's cost more to maintain. OTOH, they are a much nicer car to drive. You've got to pay more for a nicer ride!
240's can be extremely dependable cars and are pretty easy to work on. They usually run even if there is something wrong. Parts are cheaper too.
I used to be strictly a 240 guy. I was scared of 850's based on what I read in the RWD forums. I now own 2 850's and have test driven many 850's, V/S70's.. It is critical to buy a well maintained one of these or they can eat your wallet! My experience with 850's vs. 240's is that more small stuff goes wrong with 240's than with 850's. When something breaks it is usually more expensive on an 850/V70. I'm of the opinion that 850's are just as reliable as 240's, they simply need more attention.
My 95 850 wagon with 168k has almost zero squeaks, rattles and clunks (one of the reasons I bought it). It is extremely tight. In the 7 months I have owned it almost nothing has gone wrong with it. A couple of bulbs, exhaust hanger and now the infamous odometer. It has been a great used car so far. Some 850's and V70's are rattle boxes but if you search long enough you could find a jewel...:) My 240 was pretty tight when I bought it at 164k. Since then it has become a clunk, rattle and roll brick!
Hate to plug Japanese cars, but if you are simply looking for a cheap to operate modern car then a Toyota or Honda are probably your best bets. If fun is important go with a Volvo.
--
95 855 GLT Sportwagon, 93 854 GLT (for sale), 90 244 DL 300k :)
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You are correct in the price, but he is going to balk. It is time for a timing belt, water pump, rollers, tranny flush, all other fluid flushes, struts?, and an unknown Pnnnn?
If you live in a place that has emmissions checks, pass on the car. It could be something as simple as an O2 sensor, or, it could be a cold air pump and SAS valve.
Oh, ask if the oil separator has ever been replaced. That's 5 hours of labor + parts.
If the door rattles when closing, the window guide needs fixing. If the rear hatch closes with a bank, new struts.
200K is a lot of miles if there are no maint records. And a 13 year old car.
Klaus
--
Cynthia Amendt, RIP
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Thank you Klaus. We live in WA and the emission check is required. I am not sure how confirmed it is but the guy said that O2 sensor is bad... I am not familiar with oil separator...is this part of PCV system? I will ask him more about the maintenance record. Of course, it is a great car comparing to my '82. -Toshi
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Vacuum leaks cause the engine to run rich, running rich causes the O2 sensor to go bad.
Yes, the PCV 'system'. If it hasn't been replaced yet, it is over due. The piping gets old and cracked and the PTC nipple gets clogged. Check for oil leaks.
The T5 is the high pressure turbo with gobs of bhp. It has all of the options, similar to a GL 240. If it has been taken care of, then there will not be too many surprises.
The AC evaporator does tend to leak. Replacing the evap is like replacing the 240 heater core, just more wires to deal with.
Klaus
--
Cynthia Amendt, RIP
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