Hello all as I welcome my self to the dark side!

Yes, after 15 successful years of RWD ownership, a FWD has joined the family.

And yes, the long time members probably do recognize me from being so active here years ago. Anyhow, a new era begins...

My brother in law (it's always a brother in law, isn't it?) picked up a 97 850 wagon this week. Craigslist car... cheap of course, and I thought we'd be doing "standard" stuff and the dealing with the cosmetics that made the car cheap in the first place.

Well the mechanicals are looking ugly, though it does run really well and actually drives around ok. 97 855 base model, BTW, auto, no turbo, dark blue, cloth seats, 196k showing (though old title showed a probably incorrect even 220000.)

On the trip home, only 6 miles, it blew out the dipstick and made a huge mess under the hood. Oil everywhere, on the intake, top of engine, fan, dripping (pouring) everywhere.

So I serviced the flame trap, which looked like someone had been using it as a wood stove. Blocked up 90% with brown burnt chunkiness. Replaced the kit, but not the big breather system service (i.e. hoses and oil separator box).

Initial results good, pulled the dipstick and there was suction! After it warmed up, there was pressure. Not a lot as before but some... it's blowing bubbles at the base of the dipstick tube and continuing to leak, on the ground, quite an alarming amount of oil.

More to do there... I haven't serviced that breather system, I just know it's all "under there". Meantime, we fill the coolant... and that starts to puddle as well. I cannot tell where it's coming from except to say it's "the engine" as opposed to "the radiator".

Haven't had a chance to get under, get it washed off, or anything yet.

Has anyone had a freeze plug leak, or a external coolant leak from a headgasket? Those are the things that worry me at this point... I do not want quite so steep a learning curve on this car... but short of hunting down and threatening the seller, I'm not sure what to do.

Thanks in advance for all advice and hello to friends new and old...






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--Rob Bareiss, New London CT ::: 1992 244 240K ::: 1990 745GL 289K ::: 1990 745T 266K ::: 1989 244GLT Custom 271K

Take consolation it's your bil and not you. One man's money pit is another man's 850.

850s are a lot like hookers - they are both tons of fun to ride, but you gotta throw money at 'em.

I'll give you my headaches. The first was a 97 850 na, AT - bad A/C condensor, 100,000 mi
leaky rear main seal - 105,000 mi

Current 96 850T wagon -
leaky head gasket - 195,000
fuel pump, starter - 200,000
and I am pretty sure the head is leaking again (I took it to a new indy shop, they are no longer in business), I'll need to wait for the weather to warm up to see if the dip tube looses the beige oil.

I would recommend draining and flushing the rad every 20k mi instead of the recommended 30k. That environment is fairly corrosive and the coolant can eat thru the metal in the head itself. I do mine every year (about 15k) now that I've been bit once. You'd think they could add some alkalinity buffering capacity to the glycol, I mean, you spend $40-50 on the antifreeze, how much more would it increase the price? Ok, enough ranting. Good luck (he he...)
--
'96 855 Wagon, 200k (and formerly 97 850, 120k)

Our '95 854 blew a head gasket at 98k - the car never was overheated, some of the gasket just corroded away. My wife noticed it running poorly after a 15 mile highway trip - she took it to our dealer (about a mile away) and they told her not to drive it. Iit did not even lose enough coolant to notice in the overflow bottle.

One thing to check is to look down each spark plug hole with a bright light. The piston in the bad cylinder was clean as new!

Before I purchased our first 850 I lurked this board and volvospeed front wheel drive for a year. I got an insurance policy with each of the 3 that I purchased because it was evident that a lot of them were money pits - although these boards deal with problems, not reports on the Volvos that are economical.

After our 850s were brought up to stage I and any needed repairs were made, they have proven to be reliable and economical - and I have my repairs done at a dealer! We have put 110k, 110k, and 60k on these cars.

--
'96 855R,'64 PV544 driver, '67 P1800 basket case, '95 855, '95 854, the first three are mine, heh, heh, 485,000 miles put on 9 bricks

Rob,

Sounds like the car needs the full breather system service treatment! After you get that all squared away (if you think the car is worthwhile) consider switching to synthetic or doing an AutoRx treatment. This will hopefully rejuvenate the engine seals. Let us know how you make out. Maybe you can bring the patient back from the brink...:)

Klaus is right. These cars rarely have head gasket issues. Usually it's a minor leak somewhere. I had to replace my lower radiator hose when I recently did the radiator on my 95 because the cooling line above had been leaking on it. Look for leaking or squishiness where the hose attaches to the radiator. Also check the radiator's upper left (passenger side) corner for hairline cracks. That's where they usually go.

Jim

Lots of good advice so far but one important item that hasn't been mentioned is the timing belt. Sorry to pile on more $$$ but from what you've said about the PO I'd suspect that it is way overdue for replacement. It should be replaced along with the water pump, tenshioner and pulleys ASAP. If it breaks you'll shurely need that engine replaced. It's an interference head.

A day of rest?

While there is still light out, check the antifreeze first. No, headgaskets leaking antifreeze out of the engine are virtually non-existant. A headgasket leak would also mean 1 or more pistons would have zero compression.

If the car still has a splash pan/air guide, remove it. Two 10mm bolts. That will give a better indication of where the fluids are leaking from.

I sure hope this was a cheap car.

The dealer can use the Volvo scan tool to get you an accurate odo reading, only 1994/5 can the owner do it. Most dealers have a pre-purchase inspection for $100. Car gets the computer scanned, car goes up on lift and suspension and steering get inspected, etc. This would give you a pretty good punch list for what it needs and probably the miles that the odo is supposed to be showing. Of course, the dealer is trying to get your car to stay there for a week or so.

Klaus
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There is no present time, just the past and future

I guess I should have related a little more background on this... I sort of knew what we were getting into, and let B-i-L buy the car without my looking at it, figuring whatever it needed, we could fix.

My friend owns a used-Volvo shop here locally, (Eurocars Plus) and I know some of the mechanics- I can arrange some weekend shop time as needed, though I try to never abuse the privilege.

I used to work there, when the shop was new, but it's over 10 yrs ago. This car was bought by one of the customers at some point between when I worked there, and now. Then his relationship with the shop soured because of his antics... and the word gets around between shops, and it seems he couldn't get the thing worked on anywhere locally.

So it was something of an $800 gamble... but at least worst case, as noted, I could get half that back in scrap value. And it came with 2 RWD Draco rims on it, as a bonus. :) So that's $50 or more in added value....

OK getting back to its needs I appreciate the info about the headgasket... I will be power washing the thing with the splash pan off to see what we can see. I know about not getting water down into the spark plug wells... we used to get that a lot at the dealership, cars with corrosion all around the plug wires and associated misfire faults.

They will probably hate me at the self serve car wash next week...

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--Rob Bareiss, New London CT ::: 1992 244 250K ::: 1990 745T 301K ::: 1989 244 Turbo 285K

Mosr car recyclers will pay 350 to 400 dollars to to the car to the junkyard. It's always a good idea to have a reputable mechanic look over any used car you are considering buying. The breather system on the 850's is a self destruct system that the owners manual really doesn't have any service intervals spelled out. I'm guessing you need all seals replaced, including the rear main (1,500.00) a new oil trap service (500.00) and a problem with the head gasket.
Just get your brother in laws money back. Your sister won't ever speak to you again otherwise.

On the other hand,

You rebuild the engine. The initial buy on Craigslist should include an
additional investment to get the car up to snuff.
If there's no rust, you could pull the engine for the seals and then the intake manifold and head gasket jobs are easier and quick so the labor for the series of
jobs wouldn't be the sum of the individual jobs. Is that right? (If you
had it done at a garage, would your mechanic just add up the individual book rates and leave you hosed?)
Maybe you'd think about other stuff while the engine is out? rehab the starter
for instance brushes and solenoid maybe. A lot of tough jobs get easy with the engine out.

Then maybe you spend $1500-2K, but you wind up with a solid car unlike
the flimsy s-boxes coming out of asia. Picture getting T-boned in a Corolla.
$2K isn't so bad when you look at the price of some of these cheesy new cars,
where a minor 5mph bump is a huge bill at the body shop and the car is forever
twisted wrong.

Bill

Hi again Rob,

One of the 850 weak links is the ODO pinion gear
maybe your ODO was kaput for a while.
You can get the mileage from the OBD (It's easily googled)

Bill

Hi Ron, the fun begins...

There is a small hose from the flame trap to the manifold which gets really clogged, including the hole into the manifold. We have had people drilling out the hole so the vacuum resumes.

Oil is probably also pouring out of the rear cam seal on the driver's side, and then running down the block. Let's hope it is not the RMS.

Antifreeze. Check the bottom of the coolant bottle for cracks or an old hose, even a leaky cap. Pull off the cam belt cover and look at the water pump for leaks.

I hope your brother-in-law got this one for a song. Time to buy a new box of latex gloves, sounds like a lot of dirt.

Klaus
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There is no present time, just the past and future

I will not be surprised if the answer to "What's wrong with it?" is "All of the above."

The more I learn about this car, and the owner, it becomes apparent that the guy was not mechanically inclined, almost comically so, as in, it would be funny if it wasn't up to me to deal with it... the shop (my friend's shop) refused to work on it after a while due to the owner's attitude and confrontational nature.

So maintenance simply wasn't done, or was done badly, and some things were "fixed" the way they shouldn't be. I should post a picture of the plastic wall anchors used to try to fix the fuel door hinge... don't people know a new hinge is only eight bucks? No? Well, they should, before they try to fix things with wood screws...

I appreciate any and all advice with this one.

--Rob
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--Rob Bareiss, New London CT ::: 1992 244 250K ::: 1990 745T 301K ::: 1989 244 Turbo 285K

Hi Rob,

Welcome to 850-Ville.

You want to chuck the flame trap and clear out the lines from there through the port on the intake manifold, including the EGR controller, which isn't a great
driveway project in the winter. Mine was chuck full of crusty crappe'.
(Be careful that you don't reverse vac lines at the controller)
Then I switched to synthetic oil along with Bars rear main seal treatment which
luckily seemed to work after about 1K miles.
You'll probably be smart to replace all the old vac hoses to save the agony
of sudden vacuum leak misery. Maybe flush the tranny which is pretty easy (See if
the stuff looks like mud)

I'm guessing that you can clear the plugged EGR port at the intake manifold without the PIA of having to pull it.
Maybe clear it via the opening at the throttle body, and I got a harbor freight
boroscope to try it the next time. I've suggested it but no one's tried it yet as far as I know.

Bill