After over 47 days in the shop since I purchased my 1999 C70 on 6/12/99 I have been offered a replacement by Volvo. If anyone is interested in the problems I will post them, however, I am considering replacing the C70 with a S60 or S80. I still have a great fondness for Volvo but I am unsure if it is unfounded. I think we Volvo owners tend to be a little more cultish then most and are reluctant to admit that the car is not as good as we may think. Some people consider talking poorly of the Volvo analagous to criticizing their children. I really am curious as to whether my car was just an anomoly or the norm, So before I decide on an S80 I had some questions I was hoping the S80 owners in this forum would answer. I am also posting this on the S60 forum.

1)would you buy another S80?

2)Would you instead try another model, and if so which?

3)How many days has your S80 been in the shop since you purchased it?

4)What was the most serious or recurring problem you have or had?

Thanks for your help, I have to make a decision soon

Dear Mike,

I have a S80 T6 that I have owned since last Novemeber. The car has 26,000. It has been in for repairs too many times. Form day one when the car stopped because the factroty did not connect the coil wire to most rcently when the car would not resned to the throttle. I have had ignition switch replaced,softawre updates. all suspension bushing replaced. This caare has required more service than any I have ever owned. No one will rdie in the car for fear of being stranded. I would not buy one. My dealer is tremendous and perhaps my experience is an exception but for a $46K Car it should be a joy to drive. My dealer has contacted Volvo asking for a replacement. I woulod make sure of the car before you. purchase.

NO! I had a 1999, it was junk. Averaged on trip a month to the

dealer. I worked a deal wiht the dealer to get me into a new 2001 S80

I figured with two years of production under their belt they would

have gotten it right. The cars is one month has 800miles on it. I

was towed into the shop today for a busted radiator. Two weeks ago

the remotes quit working. They had to replace the Upper Electronic

Control (the rear view mirror) It is scary that is was broken but

they couldn't figure out what it was. They guessed and hopefully got

it right. Be very wary of volvo

William

Never! This ain't no luxury sports sedan, Mike. Mercedes is the right pick.

It seems that you're rather stuck with a Volvo buyout.

The C70 has had many quality control problems, and it's a

good thing that VCNA is offering to buy it back from you.

After 21K miles on my '99 2.9, I have had a few problems

that were promptly repaired - ball joints and mass air flow

sensor to name two biggies - but all in all, the car has not

had a lot of problems.

On the other hand, it has a few maddening design flaws that are

apparently uncorrectable but that I have never seen in any other

car. For example, the front seats rock about 1/16". This is due

to pivot slop that was DESIGNED IN to the car! There is even a fix

consisting of a rubber bushing to minimize the impact sensation for

"drivers that are bothered by it".

I agree with the previous posters that the S80 is a very nice,

comfortable, and competent car, but not in its class, and fails to

deliver on many of its promises.

As a point of comparison, we recently purchased a Passat V6 Wagon.

It handles better, has excellent interior finish work, is MUCH quieter (road and engine noise), has NO torque steer with greater engine torque, and cost much less. Of course, it is in a different class, but

if you compared it to the V70, it would win in almost every category

except seat comfort and, maybe, interior styling.

I would recommend that if you must accept another Volvo, that you

go for the V70. This type of car is what Volvo knows how to do best,

and represents a more reasonable form factor than the S80. If offered the

T-6, decline. The 2.9 is the largest engine that the S80 suspension, frame, and transmission can reliably handle. Don't go for Volvo "T" series

models, since they typically have way too much torque for the suspension

to handle. For resale, a Volvo wagon will win out over a sedan. I can't see the S60 holding its resale value against competition like the 323 or A4.

I'll probably look towards the Germans for my next car - maybe the 2002

A-6 when its out. But given their outrageous prices and the high cost of parts and service, I may return to the "upper-middle" sector of the market, since it offers just about everything the luxury class does without the markup.

Good luck...

Shaun

yes - get the latest build date you can - and you should be fine - i had some problems which i shared with the board with my july '98 build '99 s80 - the problems were not extreme until an incompetent dealership "butchered" i.e., cut - the subframe to replace the bushings. the dealer is since out of business - i sold it outright - lost some on it - and bought an 11/99 build '00 s80 - it was/is great - no problems - other than the ball joint recall and the o-ring fix - excellent and continuing to be completely trouble free in all respects. i sold that car to my brother-his first volvo and first car that cost more than 30k - he loves it - i bought an '01 v70 t-5 which has proven highly reliable as well. I'd avoid at all costs any of the early build s80's and will probably not ever buy an introductory model volvo - or any make - ever again - it wasn't that the early build '99 s80 was "bad" - the dealer just didn't know anything about it. go for the most recent build s80 and you should be fine - getting out of the "problem" car is the best thing you can do - put it behind you - good luck.

dan defrank

arlington tx

I bought a used 1999 S80 T6 with 44K on it in May 2000 (it was put on the road in October 1998, so it is a very early one). It's spent about 45 days in the shop in the first 6 months for various, minor to medium problems and complaints. I wanted perfection, and didn't get it.

On the other hand, it is one of the coolest cars I've ever had, and with a 4-disc in dash CD player, and a 10-disc in the rear, I change my CDs every few months and love this thing. Lots of power, strong cornering, great interior, EXTREMELY quite, I love this car, even with it's foibles. It has so many neat, unusual little features, that the button-loving engineer inside me drools over this thing.

I test drove a 2001 T6, and it has even more power (it's insane really), rides nicer, and I've heard that they fixed some of the more annoying problems. It's also the safest car that Volvo (the safe car company itself) has ever made.

Thus, if I had the money to buy a new $47000 car, I would probably buy another 2001 S80 T6. On the other hand, the Mercedes E430 is also stickering at around $47000, so I would look at that and do a feature count and quality check, but I don't know too much about it.

-John

Mike, if you are the kind of person who has endured all of those problems with the C70 and yet still looks upon Volvo with fondness, and would even consider an S80 in view of all of the negative publicity, I fear that you are going to stick with Volvo no matter what anyone tells you. As alternatives you should consider the BMW 5 series, Audi A6 2.7T, Lexus GS300, or the Saab 9-5 Aero. These are fine choices that have their own strengths and weaknesses- only you can decide which one is the right fit for you. Check out Car and Driver May 2000 for a comparison between the S80 and these other alternatives. You might find the information useful. Good luck.

Dave,

Thanks for the insight. I think that my fondness comes from memories of a 240 I had years ago. When I get in a Volvo it just feels solid to me. The only reason I am considering another Volvo is because Volvo is offering a replacement, obviously under the lemon law. I figured that this would be the least painless method of getting out of the C70 and into a new car. I am going to go down to the dealership on Sunday & drive the S60 & S80. If I get the S60 I will be breaking my rule of not buying a first year car, however with the proven motor & S80 platform I think my risk is somewhat decreased. The S80 on the other hand ought to have some of the bugs worked out of it by now.

The truth is that if Volvo handed me a check tommorow I probably would go buy one of the cars you mention. I have already test driven some of them. My opinion is that although splendid automobiles some are a bit pricey for what they offer, as is Volvo. I havn't driven the Saab, but I figured if I was going to buy a Saab I might as well buy a Volvo. I really don't know if there is much difference. BMW is definitely up there in price, especially if you want the big engine. One of my other problems is that these dealers are all a minimum of 45 miles away. The closest Volvo dealer is 70 Mi. and although I love the Audi I don't know how far I would have to go for that.

Sometimes I think the whole European car image is just a load of crap being sold to us by a bunch of companies that havn't been able to control costs while advancing their quality & performance. I drove the Acura & Lexus and although their styling leaves a little to be desired BMW, Mercedes & Volvo don't have a thing on them for the money.

Anyway thanks for the reality check. I may just take my money & thank the car Gods for giving me another chance

In its first year my S80 spent 27 days in the shop for a multitude of serious reliability, safety, and build quality problems. If you're interested in the grim details I'd be happy to share the laundry list that qualifies my car for a shrine in the automotive hall of shame.

The most serious of these problems concerns failure of the transmission, failure of the drive-by-wire throttle control, virtually every component in the front suspension, and shedding body trim parts. Many issues are design related, such as the Titanic-like turning radius; visibility to the rear quarters, power steering that runs out of assist in quick transitional maneuvers, and 'crystal radio' caliber reception.

I've driven Volvos all my life and have tolerated their foibles because I felt the cars were honest products that were filled with basic goodness. In my experience the S80 is the exception because it's shortcomings in design and build quality fall seriously short of the mark required of a legitimate player in the upscale luxury sedan segment.

Don't misunderstand me, it's not that the car is without virtue. It's a paragon of comfort, nicely styled inside and out, and a composed and competent performer with excellent brakes. I love this car which only goes to prove that love is blind because my passion ignores the reality of the ownership experience. By the same token, I couldn't in good conscience encourage another unfortunate individual to shoulder the burden that this car has been.

In this price class you can readily find outstanding performance, reliability, comfort, and safety without the pain of unfulfilled promise.

1. Yes, definately.

2. Yes, would love the new S70 wagon or hopefully someday a Volvo SUV.

3. Only in shop for regularly scheduled maintenance every 7500 miles and they took care of stuff that had come up in that one day such as front bushing. Except for one thing need a new iterior temp sensor for minor problem and they didn't have one in stock so have to get it swapped out next time.

4. It gets dirty. Actually, the bushing recall, but it was never "serious".