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As mentioned, my car will no longer start. Cranks, sometimes turns over but won't fire.
Just replaced dist. cap, rotor, wires, plugs and coil. Battery new too. No change.
Have checked fuel pump fuse (#2). Fuel pressure regulator not leaking.
Also checked electricity at cam and crank position sensors. Just got multimeter. Trying to learn this electricity thing...:) Anyone know what the readings should be at these sensors and where is the best place to check?
I'm thinking it's probably the cam position sensor or fuel pump relay. Any thoughts or suggestions from the board?
Thanks for any help!!
Jim
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Folks, sorry for the delay in updating you. Life got busy, was driving a Passat while the 850 sat in the garage until I had the time to deal with it. The fact that it has been freezing a.. cold out lately didn't help either..:)
The car now starts with the first turn of the key and runs great (as it always has). Turns out there were two separate problems:
1. The no start was due to lawnmower syndrome. At first, I didn't think lawnmower syndrome was a possibility. As I read lots of old posts, I came to realize that when I moved the car into the garage I shut it off after just driving a few feet with engine cold. Classic setup for lawnmower syndrome. So I went out and cranked that puppy for 2 or 3 minutes and she almost started. Went back the next day and she turned over with the first crank! All that cranking rebuilt the compression I had lost from the lawnmower syndrome.
2. The hard start was due to a failing starter. After curing the lawnmower syndrome, I did some more research and discovered it was probably the starter. When cold the car would start on the first or second crank. After driving 10 or 15 minutes she became very difficult to restart. Sometimes I'd have to wait a few minutes then she would restart. What was happening was when the starter was warm the starter drive pinion would not engage the flywheel. Really not surprising for a 19 year old starter with 232k on it...:)
Thanks to all who helped me with this problem! Oh, and thanks to dg for reminding today to repost with my results.
Jim
95 855 GLT 232k
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Check this entire thread, it has some resistance readings for the CPS as well as to his final solution to the nostart condition:
http://www.brickboard.com/AWD/volvo/842141/850/got_answer_1993_850_automatic_225k_miles_cranks_well_start_spark_gas.html
Just don't reply to an old thread...
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You said, "As mentioned, my car will no longer start. Cranks, sometimes turns over but won't fire."
Does it now not turn over? Sticky/dead starter solenoid or cranky ignition switch? Just some thoughts.
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Yup, I'm thinking the same two things. Check my other recent post for more info.
Ty!
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My 97 has the stupid RSR (radio suppression relay), if car has this, with a helper, I use daughter these days, have helper turn key to on position, while helper does this make sure you have 12V going to the RSR. Do this a few times to make sure you got consistent power to the relay. Of course the RSR relay should click which tells you it is sending juice (electricity) to the fuel injectors. Not sure which color wire that would be, but try a couple of them with that new digital multimeter you got. Figured all this out with my 940 and noticed my 97 850 had the same set up. Good luck.
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Where is the Radio Supression Relay?
Just checked battery @12.45 volts.
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If the starter turns the engine, that equals "cranking" - pure battery power. If, while cranking, the engine sputters, that is 'almost catches or fires'.
So, your engine "cranks" nicely but you think there is no spark or no fuel. If you pull a spark plug after cranking and it is dry, then I would suggest that you have a fuel delivery problem. Remove the top of the fuse box and pull the pump relay (#103), then jumper 15 and 87 slots and try again. You should hear the fuel pump running as soon as you turn the key to position II. If that works replace the relay.
The crank position sensor has a plug connection, unplug it close to the distributer cap and probe the wires going back to the CPS. Do a search to find the resistance.
If you replaced the plug wires, make sure that the wires are in the correct position: 1-3-5-4-2 with #3 at around 12 O'clock on the distributer cap.
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Okay, just cranked it. Cranks nicely, sputters a bit but doesn't start.
Just flipped the key to position #2 and heard an electrical buzzing sound. That's the fuel pump relay, right? So I'm guessing that relay is okay, correct? Don't have time now to pull a spark plug.
Marked the wires previously. To make sure I didn't screw up, #1 is closest to the distributor side of the head? #5 is at far side (the passenger side) of the head?
Cam position sensor the likely culprit?
Thanks, Klaus!
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Uhh, number 1 is at the timing belt end and #5 is at the distributer end. Front of the engine is the passenger side. A little re-arranging and you should be good to go.
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Wires are in correct order. I'm somewhat dyslexic but they are correct. Cranked, but didn't turn over this time.
Just checked for codes. When the car was still running I got a 1-1-2 awhile ago: = ECU fault. Just got a 1-1-4. No listing in Haynes for that. No idea what that is. Tried again and got a 1-1-1 repeatedly.
Just heard a clicking sound (maybe the starter solonoid??) below the distributor with ignition in position #2. Now she won't crank at all. New battery is drained. Any idea what could be draining the battery?
Ty!
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Brand new batteries seldom come with a full charge, usually about 11V or so. The starter will not engage when the charge is less than 10V, so charge the battery! It takes a lot of volts to spin the starter and engage the solenoid.
Which port did you read the codes from? You should be looking at A-6, the electrical systems.
A-1 = tranny and A-2 = fuel injection.
BTW, when using the diagnostic ports, a lot of battery power is also used. If you are using a trickle charger (the only good way to charge), leave it hooked up while looking at the codes.
Does the wire from the cam position sensor cross one of the ignition wires? If so, move it as leaks can disrupt the CPS signal. It is also a good chance the CPS sensor is dead after all of these years. Do a scan for CPS sensor to find how to diagnose it.
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Hi Klaus,
"Which port did you read the codes from? You should be looking at A-6, the electrical systems."
Couple of questions regarding the above quote. The last 2 times I've used port A-6 there has been no response. No blinks. Does this mean anything? Just got a new Cam Position Sensor and before I install I want to make sure I'm on the right track. Is it possible the dead port could indicate that the ignition ECU is bad? That would keep the car from starting, right?
FYI - ports A-1 and A-2 work fine with no codes.
Thx,
Jim
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Most likely a contact problem with A-6, not your computer. You could take off the computer cover and make sure it is still locked in place, hard to disengage it anyway.
Install the CPS.
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CPS wire okay. Connector feels loose though, but I think it is supposed to move around some, isn't it? Don't have time to dive into it today, unfortunately..
Trickled charged overnight and the battery still isn't charged. Short somewhere?
Thanks for all your help!
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Assuming the battery was at 9V, it will take a trickle charger 24 hours to get to 12.5V. There is always some voltage drop, radio, etc that will use milliamps, but nothing to drain rapidly. Your glove box is closed?
Turn off your day time running lights. On the light switch, push in the little screw and turn it to 11:00 o'clock. At least when you turn the key to posII the headlights and tail lights won't come on.
Getting 1-1-1 on an OBD port means there are no faults. That is a good thing. Unfortunately, if it is a bad CPS you will probably not get a code for that as the engine must be running to post a code. You will also not get a spark if the CPS is bad.
Time to pull a spark plug and check the tips for wetness, making sure the fuel injectors are delivering fuel. And then crank the engine to check for spark. I would leave the spark plug cover off until you get the engine running again.
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Tried A-6 today. Got nothing. No lights, no blinks. Strange! Then moved onto A-2, that's where I got 1-1-4 and 1-1-1.
Will check the CPS wire. Also will get into diagnosing a CPS failure. Slow charger is about to go to work...:)
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Have you tried to pull any codes yet? Give that a shot and see what you find.
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