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I am seeking advice, in a "what would you do" sort of way. My beloved '98 V70 AWD has about 206.5K miles on it. Apparently, the catalytic converter is shot and will need replacement. At 210K miles, it will be due for a timing belt. I am getting differing information about the converter--some say aftermarket converters work well for about $450, while others say they don't, and that only a Volvo cat will do (about $1200, apparently). So, it looks like, between the cat and the timing belt, I'll need anywhere from $900-$1600 worth of work done to keep the car running. I doubt I could sell the car for more than about $2K. It runs great, but has outward signs of wear (dings, dents, tearing seats, etc.) On the one hand, I hesitate to put money into a 20-year-old car that may develop additional problems with major parts (like transmission, etc.), especially knowing I would never get that money back were I to sell it. On the other, I could spend the money and end up having a good, solid car for the foreseeable future. If I were to ask myself whether I would buy this car, knowing what I know about it, for, say, $1200, the answer would probably be "yes." Am I deluding myself? Should I move on to a newer (2004-2007) XC70, for example, for about $4500? On a related note, do I HAVE to replace the converter? Can I simply drive the car with a bad converter until the car gives up the ghost, which could be years from now? Thank you for your advice on this!
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Ask someone from FCP what parts would be best for the budget. See if a local muffler place will accept customer parts -might end up being reasonable. Parts and repairs for these older cars are lower than newer. T-belt has some mileage wiggle room in my opinion and new buyer might consider that acceptable to do. There's a market for young drivers being gifted Volvos from safety minded parents. Without cat value is closer to zero. 200K is still young. Good shape value might be mid $2k +/- How much are intangibles, like how beloved, if there annoyances, how bad seat rips (can do sections at upholstery shop), AC probs, etc. How much does it cost to run per year right now? What are the other repairs needed? Good shape & good records? I personally resist the insurance claims adjuster's numbers 'totaled' way of thinking. Despite pleasure of newer vehicle, it's time consuming, a learning curve, esp dealing with new buyers and sellers. Sometimes it's clear when it's time to move on, sometimes not. Other people might have opinions, but what your own feelings, and driving pleasure, should be the loudest voice.
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Farewell 'black manta' ('97 850) Hello 'rocket sled' ('06 V70R)
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Thanks! I always get good advice on this site! It's funny how emotions become involved in a decision like this. I know it's just a car, but....
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Your last comment really hit it on the head in terms of owning a Volvo: “It’s just a car, but..”
I wish I had an answer for you, but I don’t. The only guidance I can offer, and you have mentioned this already, is that you know the history of this car in terms of maintenance.
Hugh
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If you were to do your own maintenance, eliminating the hourly mechanic's charge, I would say keep it. The timing belt isn't that hard, water pump gets a bit testy... If this is your daily driver, then it is time for a newer car. 205K is not a lot of miles for a 20 year old car. I look for newer seats in the local pick&pull because they are very cheap.
The cat converter is a different story. Left in its present state, your MPG will decline and the exhaust will eventually clog. $450 for a new downpipe/cat, is not a problem, but if you also need 2 new O2 sensors for an additional $200, we are now getting in the exit range again.
This is why ongoing maintenance should never be deferred. The bills tend to pile up and then it sounds like a 'lot' of money.
Also, if you buy another used car, make sure it has maintenance history! You don't want to buy something that needs a new timing belt within 20K, or 4 new tires.
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Keeping it running is better than buying new
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Thanks Klaus, as always. You mention that "ongoing maintenance should never be deferred," and I am wondering whether I missed something about maintenance of catalytic converters that may have led to this one's failure. I am unaware of any maintenance requirements for converters. Thanks again!
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The only 'maintenance' converters require are O2 sensors, at around 120-150K miles, and good brand gasoline. Of course, any vacuum leaks to the intake manifold must be resolved ASAP because they mess up the fuel air ratio.
A lot of 'cold' engine running will also shorten the life of the cat, like short trips.
You may sell the Volvo, your decision of course, but what are you going to replace it with?
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Keeping it running is better than buying new
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That's the problem: I don't know. I am leaning toward a newer ('04-'12-ish) xc70, but I don't know the ins and out of those. I like the 2.5T engine, which is in our '04 xc90 and has been trouble-free for 190K miles. I am good (too good, my wife says) about preventative maintenance, but it's starting to look like maybe I should have replaced the 02 sensor when it went bad. My mechanic said it wasn't necessary.
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Been there (still there), done that with our 2000 V70 SE FWD, 245K (original owner).
And I empathize with your statement "On the other, I could spend the money and end up having a good, solid car for the foreseeable future."
The favorable factors for me are that I like the car and am willing to invest in maintenance and upkeep (on its third timing belt, every 100K), with DIY work when practical and within my skills. I can't buy another car for $2,000 that I like as much and is as reliable. Plus knowing the car's history helps convince me.
My car is in California and still running the assembly line cat and O2 sensors, with biannual smog checks. CA's less corrosive environment certainly helps. Because of CA's mandated emissions checks, I couldn't get away with running a defective cat, which in the long run probably is bad for the car (and environment) anyway. (With a defective cat, doesn't the CEL come on?).
The negative factor for my car could be the AW-55 5-speed automatic gear box, which has a lousy reputation. With (3309 ATF) fluid changes every 75K the transmission is still performing normally. If/when the transmission does go, then it would be serious decision time to consider another car.
I'd say that many of us face this same decision making process!
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Thanks Robert,
The CEL is on, but for some reason, I'm told that the rear O2 sensors are an "exempt item" for these cars (at least in VT). The tranny is strong, but, as you say, who knows how long that will last?
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Regarding transmission life, of course it depends on how the car is driven. But I’m convinced and the Brickboard forum reinforces it, that periodic regular ATF changes prolong transmission life. 70K-75K miles seems to work in my case. But I don’t use the car for towing. It does go up and down hills a lot, with frequent downshifting.
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The tranny might be last thing you need to worry about...:) The 98 and earlier transmissions are pretty much bulletproof except for the 93 850. Most 850's and the 98 s70, v70 and XC's all have the same 4 sp automatic transmission. My 95 850 still has its original tranny at 250+. Changed over to synthetic when I bought the car. No issues.
The 5 speed trannies in the 99-02 have had some issues though.
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+1 for the bulletproof 4-speed auto-boxes! My comment was offered from the perspective of the AW55-50SN 5-speed auto, which came with our 2000 V70 SE and is now at 246K miles. Not nearly the solid reputation that the 4-speed has.
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