posted by
someone claiming to be Kat
on
Sun Sep 8 16:57 CST 2002 [ RELATED]
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My ABS & Tracs Off lights are both going on and off. I had a problem when slowly pressing the brake to stop, the brake pedal would sometimes kick in and out and pulsate as if ABS brakes were engaged. Volvo said I need a new module-$560. I went to a mechanic who claims to specialize in Volvo's and he insisted the problem is NOT the module but the ABS wheel sensors. He replaced the rear wheel sensors. Not 2 days later, lights going on/off again. He looked at it again and made some minor adjustments. (Incidentally, he claims to have same diagnostic equipment as Volvo.) The same night I picked it up, the lights went on/off again. I don't have the pulsating anymore when I press the brake but now every so often I hear a springing/clicking sound, then the lights go on. Now I am reading this website about this module problem with '98 S70's. Was Volvo right and this mechanic wrong? The mechanic called me a couple of days ago to see how things were going and he asked me to bring it in again. He still insists it is not the module. Now he thinks it might be a selenoid (sp?). Who do I believe?
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Hi Kat,
Just had mine fixed on 9/11. It was the ABS/Tracs control module, a free replacement under extended warranty.
Regards,
Mike Harris in Sandy Eggo
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posted by
someone claiming to be Kat
on
Sat Sep 14 19:13 CST 2002 [ RELATED]
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Hi Mike,
Yes, I just had the module replaced by the Volvo dealer a few days ago. Unfortunately, mine was not under warranty. But it's fixed and I am having no problems whatsoever. Now I am going to try to see if I have any recourse against the mechanic who ripped me off.
Kat
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KAT,
Listen to Davidm and others like myself who have had this problem. The problem is a defective ABS module and Volvo refuses to admit it YET and take responsibility and recall the part. Contact the NHTSB AND Volvo and let them know about this dangerous problem. When that light is ON your ABS brakes are NOT working and you could have a serious accident.
Volvo customer service( that's a joke) contacted me in response to my letter but offered me no assistance at all with the repair.If the part costs approx. $350, why do they charge $600 for the repair. Is the labor worth $250? I think not! Perhaps someone with media influence could go to the Fox problem solvers or in some other way get this problem out to the general public.
What really bugs me is that Volvo would rather lose the future purchases of the many long time volvo owners who have complained , rather than repair an obvious defective part.
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The vast majority of the failures are in the 1996 850's and 1998 70-class Volvos. For the purposes of data collection, I'd recommend you post a report to the NHTSA if (IF) it turns out to be the ABS module. http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/ivoq/default.htm
David
(98 S70 T5SE Black, misc mods (mostly lighting), red calipers) (92 940GLE)
(Previous: 86 240DL / 88 745T / 94 945T)
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posted by
someone claiming to be Frank
on
Tue Sep 10 00:28 CST 2002 [ RELATED]
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Davidm and myself have had this saftey discusion here before not long ago (he probably bookmarked the url) BUT as far as real safety's concerned, even though ABS is inop, the car still stops just like all cars that don't have ABS. When the ABS light is on, the ABS system is inop and by seeing that light, you should then know that it's inop and IF you're driving in ice or snow (the only time where ABS comes in handy), you'ld then know that you'll have to brake like you would with any car w/o ABS.
I suppose that if you're younger and have only driven newer cars with ABS in winter and don't know how to use the brakes on a car w/o ABS on slipery surfaces, that then "might" be a problem? That'd be ones only real arguement concerning ABS safety IMO.
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posted by
someone claiming to be johnh
on
Tue Sep 10 03:47 CST 2002 [ RELATED]
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Frank:
If what you say is true, why do you reckon we have ABS at all? It sure isn't free! If it has nothing to do with safety, maybe the cost of it could be better spent on reliable A/C evaporators.
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posted by
someone claiming to be Frank
on
Tue Sep 10 15:26 CST 2002 [ RELATED]
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ABS helps keep the car from skidding uncontrollably in conditions where one or more wheels might slide such as on snow, ice, loose gravel and it's a good thing, no doubt BUT one can still drive and safely stop a car w/o it as I've done in all my cars for the last 30 yrs and I'm in an area with winters.
I have never once slid off the road in the winter yet I pass many newer cars, PUs and SUVs with ABS that still manage to slide off the roads.
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This is the most repeated topic on the FWD board....and in 98 70-class, this is an acute problem (as has been reported here by someone claiming to be Frank, a Volvo tech). It is almost certainly the module in the 98 and Volvo prescribes a swap instead of a repair. The part is $348 if you buy it yourself online - Volvo will charge you $416 for the part. The failure is rumored to be related to solder failure (Frank disputes this) and it looks like Volvo is recovering the units, perhaps for remanufacture. The new module is warranted for a year. It's located under the ABS pump block.
Please, please, please, if it's the module, do all owners of FWD Volvos a favor and report it to the NHTSA (the people in charge of safety recalls and certain TSBs) at their online site: http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/ivoq/default.htm. Perhaps if they had enough data, maybe there's something they could mandate such as a recall, or at least a notification to all owners of 98 70-class Volvos.
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posted by
someone claiming to be Frank
on
Tue Sep 10 00:19 CST 2002 [ RELATED]
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Ever since the first guy posted the solder idea for FP relays in the RWD forum, many seem to think that if solder helps those, it must be the problem with "everything Volvo related".
I dispute that idea with ABS control units because I have yet to read ANY real proof by anyone. I'm the type who always challenges "authority" and IMHO, for good reason. Until I read anything official (or even otherwise by someone who really knows) OR see the problem myself, I simply don't believe the solder theory about this or other ECUs. There are ALOT of little parts inside that ECU so who's to say which one's going bad here w/o knowing for sure?
One thing I do know, if you take an ABS ECU apart, you will NOT see anything that's obviously bad (the solder LOOKs fine too btw).
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I'll be sure to put in the modifier that I neglected to put in the last post; I don't want to be the purveyor of potentially erroneous information.
The number one cause of failure in any printed circuit board is solder joints, especially if they're subject to physical movement. So in theory, this would be a strong candidate. Secondarily, one might look to a bad diode or something, but that's highly unlikely, and the cpu on the processor wouldn't be a candidate at all. It's very likely cracks in the solder or the wafer board itself that cause the failure. DIY repair would be difficult because of the silicone sealant that would need to be removed, and eventually re-flowed.
My indy tech has also heard that solder failure is the problem, but as he is Volvo certified, he follows protocol and swaps the board. He also reports that once swapped, the fix is effective and permanent.
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posted by
someone claiming to be Frank
on
Tue Sep 10 15:34 CST 2002 [ RELATED]
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I still challenge that idea because it's pure speculation at this point. That circuit board doesn't move (vibrate, etc) any more than any other ECU (one of many) found on all newer cars these days and most of those outlast the rest of the cars.
I suggest that you obtain a used, junked ABS ECU, take it apart and look inside for yourself. I think you'll see my point about this.
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I will get my hands on one this week and look at it; I'll even run over to my alma mater and put it under a microscope. Still, the number one reason for circuit board failure is solder failure, secondarily wafer board cracks (breaking printed circuits). The probability of one of these two being the problem is over 90%.
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posted by
someone claiming to be Frank
on
Wed Sep 11 23:45 CST 2002 [ RELATED]
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OK, keep us informed if you see anything.
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posted by
someone claiming to be Frank
on
Mon Sep 9 00:06 CST 2002 [ RELATED]
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The dealer as your other guy was/is wrong. When the '98 X70 ABS light comes on, it's almost always codes for either rear wheel sensors or ABS pump motor yet neither is really the cause, the cause is a bad ECU and it's now becoming a VERY common problem.
Do not have your indy guy throw any more un-necessary parts at the car because he's wrong, it IS the ABS control unit. The part costs $416 from our dealer but some here have found cheaper prices elsewhere. Search the recent threads on this exact same subject. This subject is now discussed here weekly so look down the threads if you don't want to believe me.
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