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Or better, how do you handle hills? Reason I ask is that there is a hill I have to conquer to and from school. I'd say it's a noticeable hill though not steep, but it makes most 18-wheelers go to the far right. There's like a slight downgrade before you reach the hill, so I try to gain speed and kinda catapult my turtle (my new term of endearment) up the hill. But since this is done in the far right, I'm sometimes forced to slow down for a slow car up ahead :| I usually go at a bit over 40mpg up the hill, but that's me being conservative. I just don't feel confortable putting the pedal to the metal because, for one, it waste gas and I just don't want to strain the little engine. Do you guys gas it up hills, and if you do, how fast can do you take your 240?
Sometimes I might be caught behind a very slow semi or bus, but I can't switch to the left lane to pass it because gaining speed on an uphill incline takes like forever--sorta like slow motion, ya know. Still, I love my 240!
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I do OK in the 240/740 even through the long steep grades of the WV Appalachains. The cars definitely go down better than they go up. Sort of like a piston-engined fighter plane.
My two step procedure for going up hills:
Step one: get up a head of steam (5-10mph above the speed limit)
Step two: keep that head of steam
If you lose your momentum, downshift. With an automatic, you either kick down by hitting the gas to the floor and bringing the pedal up... or just hit to OD override button on the shifter.
If you're stuck in the right lane behind a truck and you need to accelerate before changing to the left lane, you'll never get there if you follow just a few car lengths behind the truck. Slow down first to give your self lots of room to accelerate, accelerate, THEN merge. Actually kind of fun.
Remember, it's hard to break these cars by mashing on the gas pedal... so don't worry.
-Ryan
--
--------------------------
Athens, Ohio
1990 245 DL 130k M47, E-codes
1991 745 GL 280k (Girlfriend-mobile)
Buckeye Volvo Club
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But then again, it's a Diesel :)
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My car hates going up hills and loves going down them! I can pass all other cars going down hill, with my foot on the clutch. Gotta love/hate these Marin/Sonoma hills. ;-p
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Marin-Sonoma Hills? Not sure where they are.
I'm from New Jersey, but last week for the first time we visited our daughter who has recently moved to L.A., and on one day we went to visit her boyfriend's family in San Bernardino. Well, before dropping by, they took us from Rt. 10 up a road (rt. 18, named "Rim of the World") to Lake Arrowhead. Steep climbs, along the edge of a cliff upbound, for about 20 miles of sharp switchbacks(elevation over 5,100 ft at the top).
It was a lot of fun, especially for me -- I was driving! And it was my daughter's '07 S60, whereas I'm used to only 240s, so you can imagine this was a lot of fun, what with twice as much horsepower and torque!
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posted by
someone claiming to be 240_Newbie
on
Mon Jan 15 18:08 CST 2007 [ RELATED]
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I'm able to climb the Sierra Nevadas at 60-65mph...Now, my old 260 Diesel was a s-l-o-w mother when it came to climbing hills.
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HI!
If You sift gear, when the engine rpm`s drop under the highest torque point, car does not freeze. Then it works all the time effectly and did not take extra gas. My daily used GLT handle all hills in here south just sift out the OD. Don`t need to take extra speed under. ( Trucks speed 60 mph drops usually to 30 in the top ) My "Black Devil" does not need sift at all, just take little more pedal and speed remains the same. Of course GLT has B-23E ( 140 hp OEM ), "Devil" has B-250R ( 204 hp) There is a little differences, of power. Anyway all engines like, when the rpm`s are just a little above max torque point. Too low rpm`s are poison, then vacuum is in "red zone",bad to the engine and fuel economy. So simple!
YRS: WEBERMAN
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posted by
someone claiming to be Lawrence
on
Wed Jan 10 20:54 CST 2007 [ RELATED]
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I think its all been said, but I must get my 2 cent in.
The b230 has the heart of a lion. It is up to the task. Trust it. when you need it, go for it.
The only thing that would keep me from attacking a hill, and charging up , with high rpms all the way to the top, would be a desire to conserve fuel. The "little 4 banger" can handle it.
I actually dont advocate driving that way, but Ive driven that way enough to satisfy myself that the B230(and its drive train) are not(!)fragile .
Happy motoring.
L.
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Drive it like it hate it!!!! I live amoung the mountains of Tennessee. The main hill is Lookout Mountain. We have a road that runs up the very edge of the mountain and I take it at full throttle. But as another said the manual tranny works a lot better on hills. As I have replaced nearly all of my suspension with poly parts and bigger sways, Bilsteins, and stiffer coils, I can handle a few hilly curves. Actually I drive the mountains for stress relief and pure enjoyment..As far as wasting gas, I am doing my part to obtain this goal. I figure if all the gas is gone when we can go on to newer fuels types.
--
Max..1989 244 DL 5 Spd., V15 Phase II Cam Bilstein HD, Turbo Swaybars, Poly Bushings all round, Turbo Wheels, Black leather interior, Electric mirrors, LED dash and gauge lights and now NEW ECODES with the turn signals, 1992 black 244 next project
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I get up north of Phoenix to Sedona and Flagstaff every couple of months, and that means climbing from about 1200 feet to over 7000 feet. I-17 is posted at 75 mph for most of that drive, which means that traffic is moving at 85 mph.
Having just made that trip this weekend, my '92 245 (with M47) did just fine, although a turbo (or simply another 50 hp) would help at the higher altitudes. I had no trouble passing slower vehicles, and most hill-climbing was done in 4th gear with an occasional jog down to 3rd to pass someone. My car is no stranger to full-throttle running. FWIW, for those who avoid full-throttle for reasons of economy, recognize that at any given engine speed, wide open throttle (WOT) is where an engine operates at its peak output and efficiency. (And don't interpret that as meaning you should drive at WOT all the time!)
FWIW, over 2 tankfuls I averaged about 26 mpg... driver + 2 passengers, lots of hill climbing, and most highway cruising at 80-85.
--
Thank goodness we don't get all the government we pay for. -- Wiley Post
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I use to worry about straining the engine in my 355k miler, but just hit it up the hill, she will do fine. the issue seems to be that the transmission downshift cable doesn't cause the tranny to downshift untill the car is at 70-80% throttle. I personally don't care, my brick seems to thrive on rpm...I usually just stomp it. Around here in Pittsburgh we have some back roads that are one lane each way with up to 40% grade...yes 40% it is insain...the kind that can cause a brick's front bumper to scrape when approaching. if I am stuck behind a slow truck or a blue haired geezer, I just click her out of overdrive and cruise up the hill in the calm but effective portion of the power range the little red block produces. I say, just punch it....the bottom ends of these engines are some of the best I have yet seen and the top end and valve train are not only rugged, but simple. good luck
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Plan your attack,be patient.
I downshift and maintain 55-60 mph if possible.
Faster than that is a waste of fuel IMO.
Pedal to the metal is ok if that's what it takes,but
lugging it is not good.
As we say in the bike racing buisness;
Spin to Win,Train don't Strain.
Speaking of straining,ride your bike up a hill slowly
in a big gear,and you will quickly understand.
--
White 86-245 DL, M 46, IPD bars & Wagon Overloads,Commando Bumpers,SS Belly Pan & Air Pickup,Straight-Shot EMT Chassis & Tower Braces,Scorpius Alloys,2 Belt No AC Conversion,Black POR-15 No Glare Front End
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RW, you bike? Road or Mountain? I like mt. biking, though I've been lazy about riding...too cold, too hot, too late at night, etc., ya know, the excuses :P
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Hey, I just saw your picture. That rack (especially but not only with a bike on it) can really slow you down on the hills, adding considerably to the air resistance you have to overcome. I know -- I occasionally put a Thule rack on the car to carry things, and sometimes I'm too lazy to take the rack off (even after unloading the stuff on it) and I can feel a difference -- so I try to take it off every time I'm finished using it.
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Ken, does your Thule have a fairing that you put on? I have it on mine, and I've noticed that it works well as a sort of a sunroof wind deflector. But anyway, that's besides the point. Yeah, I've heard a roof rack can decrease gas mileage. I know the fairing is designed to reduce noise more so than drag. In fact, I would think it increases drag. So I wonder if one takes it off would it allow air to flow freely and naturally over the roof? Hmmmm.
I normally don't ride with the bike on the roof unnecessarily, but I can certainly understand how it can increase drag, thus reducing your speed and gas mileage. It's just a pain to take it off and put it back on.
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Hey Ugly Duck, a year younger and we'd be driving the 'exact' same car. can you give me info on what Thule rack fits on the wagon. Mucho Grassyass.
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The rack I have is the one that mounts on the rain gutter, not the one that goes between the doors or anything like that. I forget the part number, but I think the Thule website may have it. It's definitely a perfect fit for cars with gutters. The bars I think are 50lb load bars. If this is for a mountain bike with disc brakes, I'd definitely suggest you get the bike mount (forget the technical term for this part, but it's the piece where your bike rests on) that supports disc brakes, as older versions, like mine, don't give enough clearance for the fork brake caliper up front. I've heard you can cut a slot to give enough space for the caliper or there is also an adaptor, but I dunno how that works.
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I have two Thule-brand racks -- the kind that clamp to the rain gutters. One is a pair for skis and snowboards (I keep their adapters on this one for convenience), and the other is a pair that are a plain "utility" rack that I can switch off between a kayak carrier and plain "butt" clamps to carry lumber and other miscellaneous stuff.
No wind deflector or fairing on either, so I've got no experience with it. But noise is certainly another issue (besides air resistance). I don't know, though, about it increasing air resistance as you suggest. I'm not a pilot, but I've got a sailboat (wings and sails are both airfoils and do roughly the same things), and I can see how a smoother flow of air, even though deflected, could lessen not only noise but also air resistance. Those crossbars and upright supports in a bare-bones bike carrier, let alone one with a bike onboard, really set up lots of eddy currents (i.e., turbulance) around these obstacles that will not only create noise but also hold back the car. Deflecting most of the air over such obstracles, so that less air actually strikes and whips around them, could be an advantage.
If you don't think that straight poles create much resistance, an example of sailboats might be instructive. In higher winds, e.g., during a storm at sea, a sailboat can be propelled straight downwind (often reaching "hull speed" -- i.e., maximum without planing) without any sails at all. Simply the wind on the mast is sufficient -- this is called sailing "barepoled" -- and the boat usually has to be slowed deliberately by dragging "warps" in the water behind it in order to maintain better steering control as well as to prevent pitchpoling.
In any case, anything you can do to reduce the drag and turbulance can be helpful.
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Indeed, bicycles may be another common 'thread' among Volvo people.
Yes, in fact I had a bike shop for 11 years in Tiburon, Marin County Cal.
During 82-93 when the Mountain Bike was first being developed.
Good times great people,the guys I rode road bikes with, Fisher,
Breeze,Cunningham ect were instrumental in the early off road designs.
It's track bikes and mountian bikes nowadays for me.
Nice wagon in the pix,Virgo's,clean,a little rake,sweet ride!
I know what you are saying about getting stuck behind a semi at 35-40,
but that's life in a turbo-less brick.
Ken
--
White 86-245 DL, M 46, IPD bars & Wagon Overloads,Commando Bumpers,SS Belly Pan & Air Pickup,Straight-Shot EMT Chassis & Tower Braces,Scorpius Alloys,2 Belt No AC Conversion,Black POR-15 No Glare Front End
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Cool, Redwood. You still ride? And since you had a bike shop, I bet you have built many a dream bike! You have a stable?
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My cars (one '84 and two '93s, all n.a.) all love hills (and long highway grades with the trucks forced to the right in the slow lane for a change), or rather, I love taking these cars and flying up them, leaving traffic in the dust. I've yet to see a trooper stalking the uphill side, so I have little worry speeding.
But you seem to feel that your car has a problem? I'm wondering why. Surely, we don't have seven liter V-8s under the hood, but the torque is there to use if you want to use the gears. Do you just keep it in Drive? Or just let the transmission downshift-upshift-downshift-upshift? Why not just keep it in 3rd so that the tranny isn't jolted by periodic full-throttle shifts? A manually timed shift at less than full throttle is a lot less of an impact on the car's drivetrain.
As I approach a steep hill, I use my overdrive lockout, and in third gear in 3,500 to 4,500 rpm or so, the cars really climb?
Don't be afraid of using rpms! That's a lot better for the car than "lugging" it.
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Hmmm, yeah, I tend to just "drive" with no messing with the shifter or OD. I keep the OD on at all times. So you mean to say turn OD off?
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I'm with the folks advising higher rpms via downshift one way or another.
As stated elsewhere in this thread, the engine power peaks at higher rpms.
Learn from below how fast that motor can spin:
Finally one day taking the suggestion to do an "Italian tuneup" in my auto-tranny 245, I consulted the manual to try to learn how fast you can be driving and still drop it into 2nd. I also tried pegging the gas at about 40 mph and kept it there - to see if/when it would go up into 3rd with my foot all the way down.
I maybe don't have enough nerve. The d**n thing STAYS in 2nd up to 70 mph and beyond if I keep my foot down.* Best power in 2nd seems to be between about 45-60/65. Considering that the tranny is programmed that way I assume those are safe rpms. All our cars are tachless, and I'm tactless to match.
I think it's probably better to downshift via lever or button while still at half-thtrottle or so. That should avoid some mechanical stress of changing speed while delivering max mechanical energy. But I don't always do that.
It scares the wife if I do it with her in the car, so I have to behave myself at those times. If your intake and exhaust are stock it doesn't sound quite as scary when you let it rip.
* Mine is a wagon. If yours is a sedan you have slightly higher rpms at any given road speed [due to smaller tires] so your max speed in any gear will be just a bit lower.
--
Sven: '89 245 NA, 951 ECU, open-front airbox, E-fan, 205/65-15's, IPD sways, E-Codes, amber front corner reflectors, quad horns. Wifemobile '89 245 NA stock. 90 244 NA spare, runs.
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Can't ignore the standard things to watch out for.
Grandma's solid oak chest of drawers in the cargo bay
tuneup 20,000 miles ago with bad plugs (Bosch Platinum = BAD)
hot/cold airbox damper thermostat stuck in "hot" position
loose roof rack components, rattling in the wind
- well nut fasteners are USA size 1/4 S, see a hdw store
knobby snow tires, only 25 psi [try 35 psi]
low octane gas (fine for flat roads with no load maybe)
15-40 or 20-50 oil. That stuff is thick.
- I recommend 10-30 unless your climate is like south Florida
intake leaks
I'm sure there's more.
--
Sven: '89 245 NA, 951 ECU, open-front airbox, E-fan, 205/65-15's, IPD sways, E-Codes, amber front corner reflectors, quad horns. Wifemobile '89 245 NA stock. 90 244 NA spare, runs.
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Just tell every one you own a Rolls. Rolls-can-hardly to be more precise. Rolls down hills and can hardly make it up the other side.
Old joke, sorry.
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You drop it out of OD while still on the flat and let the engine find it's power. The OHC red block develops max HP at 5200-5400rpm, and max torque at 2750-3500rpm depending on year (source = Volvo green books). They love to rev, even if they do sound like they're going to blow until you get used to it.
It may even make it run better if you "blow it out" once in a while, back in the day we used to call it the "Italian tune up". Prolonged operation at speed & load burns off carbon buildup and generally cleans things up.
Coming back to San Diego from the Davis meet one year I pulled the Grapevine (very steep/long run on 5 north of LA) at a steady 85mph/OD locked out, 4500rpm for ~5 minutes straight, ran like a champ. When I used to deal with freeways I routinely hit 4000+rpm in 2nd (60mph) on on-ramps. The '88 (B230/AW-70) did this for years with no ill effects.
All a 240 asks for is clean oil and routine maintenance, rev it up and keep up with the traffic, your fuel mileage won't take much of, if any hit off of one hill, and your car will love you for it.
--
Dave Shannon
Durango, CO
'63 P-210
'67 1800s
'88-240
'06 F250 Diesel 4X4
my pages
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I think you're looking for techno advise so here it is. Keep the RPMs at an effiecent power level when going up hills. Drop a gear or kick it out of overdrive w/ automatic. You won't waste gas in the long run just because the engine speed is faster. And BTW ... never heard of hurting one of these engines with too high an RMP ... if there is a load on it.
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Push the pedal down, the boost gauge swings over to 15 psi, and the top of the hill approaches rapidly as I make my way past the slower traffic.
--
'63 PV544 rat rod, '93 Classic 245 + turbo
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posted by
someone claiming to be nigelb1
on
Mon Jan 8 22:25 CST 2007 [ RELATED]
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if i get a head start it's ok, i would never put it to the metal, a downshift is ok , if theres not much traffic i just let it slow down to where it slows down to. like 40mph (on highway)
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um....my 240 likes to go fast...i make the trip home from MI to WI, 5 hours at around 65-85 and Douglas is fine with it. Averaging about 70mph with a full car i get around 28mpg, with a 5 speed. I dont really slow down for hills...sometimes if its a steep one i find halfway up that i need to downshift, but i havent found any hills that are too much for Douglas.
--
I am Joe,- Blue '89 Volvo 244 DL 5-speed w/ 190k, 23mm GT Sways F&R named Douglas
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My one cent
Looking at the response of other people it seems that you have an automatic so my post does not match here.
But as I am bored at work so here is how I do it with my 5 speed manual wagon.
I take most hills in 3rd at 40 MPH or at 4th if I have space for speed or for that matter 5th is also valid .
So far I have rarely put it in 2nd for a hill unless behind a car at 20-30 mph .
Sometimes I shift to 2nd and then immediately to 3rd .All this keeps the engine revving hapily in power band. Heel and tow shifting and double de-clutching def helps in avoiding jerks and having some co ordination with braking and accelerating at the same time.
Only issue with a manual is if you stop midway up a steep hill in heavy stopping/crawling traffic. But even with full load of passengers and cargo 1st does the job without slipping the clutch. If you mess up clutch release and accel. clutch squeals as if you have crushed a pig under the tires.
Even after doing all this RPM rarely croses over 3500. I have felt that 93 octane with some fuel additives gives better
acc.
Regards
Gopesh
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Speaking of that silly squeel. I can avoid it when shifting between gears (e.g. 1st and 2nd or 2nd and 3rd) by just waiting a brief second while the clutch is depressed.
My problem is starting from a standstill in first. If I really try to get up and go (I know, ha ha ha) I always end up with the squeel. I've never had this with any other vehicle that I've owned (3 VWs, a nissan sentra, and a toyota matrix (wife's car)).
Any suggestions?
Kev
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You are right it usually happens when starting from standstill .It does not happen in other cars may be because of short clutch travel. ( I think one can adjust that within limits i.e. make the clutch engagement sooner ).
This car does not like being rushed through gear say as Honda likes. It also has tall gearing ist and 2d 3rd all ratios are spaced far apart.
I have noticed that this squeal happens only when you are pushing gas paddle aggressively while the clutch is still not fully released esp say at trafiic lights when you want to check how fast you are in comparison to the guy in next lane.With time I have now brought this happening to very rare occasions that too for uphill starts.
For uphill starts from standstill I start releasing the clutch while still breaking ,as soon as I feels that clutch is getting engaged I slip my foot to gas ( U know the uphill crawling traffic when the guy in rear is 2' from your rear bumper )
For other methods pertaining to better gear shifting here is a link which describes heel and two shifting in case you do not know this. It is good for this tall geared car.
http://www.edmunds.com/ownership/howto/articles/45792/article.html
If you do not press brake while downshifting then the same thing becomes double declutching. This is the link for that
http://www3.bc.sympatico.ca/Volvo_Books/trans1.html
See section WHAT IS DOUBLE CLUTCHING? HOW CAN IT IMPROVE SYNCHRO LIFE?
Once you get used to it you will like to downshift and break like that.
I hope I have not offended you with these things. I am just sharing as I learned these techniques barely a year ago although I have mostly driven manual cars.
Regards
Gopesh
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No offense whatsoever. Interesting articles. I may try the heel-toe downshift today (but in my driveway first). Thanks.
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