My wife and I have been having a discussion and I'm turning to all of you for your advice. My 94 940 wagon is at 136k miles. I've had it four years and here is what I've done to it:
- timing belt at 100k
- new radiator at 100k
- new belts and hoses at 100k
- all fluids changed at 85k
- new motor mounts at 130k
- new tires at 120k, yokohama avids
- tires precision balanced
- new tie rod ends last year
- new cat, new exhaust
- new brake pads a while back
- air conditioning compressor

What it needs:
- strut inserts and shocks - cost $680, for bilsteins
- transmission mounts - $150
- seals at timing belt are seeping. I figure I can wait a year on this and do the timing belt closer to 150k. Do you agree?

My thought is that, once I do the struts, shocks, tranny mounts and timing belt it won't need much until the timing belt at 200k

In the last 4 years all the maintenance above has cost me $4700 and I've put 54000 miles on the car. Cost per mile, including depreciation and scheduled maintenance has be 14.4 cents/mile. Bought the car at 86k for $6800 with solid maintenance records (all by the dealer).

Guess I'm on the fence because I'm looking at about another $1000 to spend on a car thats probably worth about $3500 on the market. Do you agree?

What would you do?

Where do you live I'll buy it as is.

My 2 cents worth is fix it up.

I bought one 3 years ago on ebay (pd $2100). Drove from North Georgia to upstate NY to pick it up. Fell in love with it on the way home. When I got home, wife walked out to look at it and announced "this one's mine". I bought every mount, bushing I could, had new Bilsteins mounted with new coils, tires, brakes, rotors ... about 3 grand worth of goodies before I let her take it. I can say with confidence it was te best money I have ever spent ... she has put 200k miles on it since (has 362 on it now..never any problems)...yes, she drives A LOT in her job. Only money spent since then has been maintenance.

Yes, I am biased...bigtime!
Best of luck with whatever your decision is!!!!

randyB

the bottom line is....how do you personally feel about the car. keeping it makes perfect sence to me, but if wifey hates to drove it and you aren't passionate about it maybe it doesn't make sense to you. from a purely economic stand point, rarely if ever will it be cheaper to replace than repair. do a cost analysis per mile on a new car for the first year and tell me who wins the cheap battle...(down payment + interest + increased insurance + tags + registration + inspection + destination charges + 12 montly payments) - somewhat increased fuel economy = way way way more cost.
my 244 is worth about $400 in one piece. every year i spend about double that in repairs and up keep...lets see you get into a newish car for $800 a year

Personally, I love it. To me, the big boxy volvos stand for durability, frugality, patience, reliability, economic independence, independence from being a new car junky. I think people outside this board would consider me a bit of a crank. But I just really love old volvos. This is my fourth.

Dear markus,

May this find you well. The BBV (Big Boxy Vehicle) is a low-cost form of life insurance. If you drive a 940 wagon, there are 6.5 feet (about two meters) of heavy metal, between the back of the car, and the back of your seat. If you have children in the rear seat, there are still 3.5 feet of steel (one meter) to protect them.

This steel is carefully engineered to crumple, and so to dissipate collision energy, and to channel remaining collision energy from the passenger compartment. This protection is totally passive. The newer CRV (Cute Round Vehicle) has more airbags, but less metal mass. While air bags are very reliable, they depend on sensor working properly.

Further, CRVs are almost all front-wheel drive. The engine bay is tight-packed with equipment. In a front-end collision, high value items will be damaged, because there's little space to absorb collision energy. Maintenace of CRVs is more costly, because more things have to be removed. By contrast, the 940 engine bay is spacious.

The economic case for sticking with your car is unassailable. The life insurance case, for continuing to drive a BBV is equally clear.

Hope this helps.

Yours faithfully,

spook

I may be nuts, but i think that most modern aka new vehicles on the market surpase volvos from the 80's in crash safety. Bricks can stil hold their own, but modern cars are downright safe compared to cars of even 10 years ago where dual airbags were not entirely common. Volvo made it's name for safety in the 0's and 70's american market where safety was less than an after thought. Science has shown us that metal mass and safety have very little to do with one another. in fact in a collision with a stationary object more metal mass is detrimental regardless of where it is placed. the safest cars in the world are F1 racers....they are ultra light and shatter to dissapate force.
I was in a horriffic crash in a 2005 wrx (passenger)...we jumped 20 ft vertically and 90ft horizontally at approximatly 80mph...landed on all 4 tires bounced and fliped 2 times landing on the roof, and flipped 3 more times comming to rest on all 4 tires once again. both myself and the driver walked away with little more than bumps and bruises. The car was totally destroyed, no airbags deployed. Would you replicate that in a 80's vintage brick? especially one with 20 years of metal fatigue and rust. Not to bad mouth volvo, more to praise modern engineers.

Dear illbird68,

May this find you well. Thank you for sharing your horrendous experience!

You prove my point. Your safety was assured by:
(a) your wise use of seat-belts
(b) your car's structural strength.

I'd guess an '05 vehicle has plenty of airbags. That didn't help (or hurt) you, as they didn't deploy.

A Volvo 940 - presuming it is not rusted-out - would have protected you as well. The 940 costs far less to maintain, than any '05 vehicle - almost all of which are front-wheel drive. The reason: the 940 is a less complicated car (for example, less electronics). Because it is less complicated - and there's far more room in the engine bay - it is owner-maintainable.

It is easier for a "shade tree mechanic" to do jobs that require:
(a) fewer specialized tools and/or customized software
(b) the removal of fewer things, to access the item, that needs fixing,

In short, the 940s were made at a "sweet spot":
(a) enough electronics to improve fuel efficiency and to ease diagnosis
(b) enough airbags to supplement structural strength
(c) rear-wheel drive, to ease maintenance
(d) enough room inside the wagons, to allow their use for serious hauling.

Car makers' quest for fuel economy has driven them (pun intended) to try to save weight, wherever possible, even if that puts the passengers at risk. The extra money I spend for fuel to drive a 940, is more than offset by lower maintenance costs, since I can do most things myself. On top of that, I get a car that will protect me at least as well as any CRV, and has lots of interior room for hauling.

The example of the race car does not persuade me. Race cars have heavy-duty steel safety cages, that protect the driver. The safety cage allows the body structure to be made ultra-light.

Your report underscores the importance of using seat belts, all the time.

Yours faithfully,

Spook

Darn right. Love for "Old Volvos" got nothing to do with safety. It is just nostalgia for the past. A car that we can still see in movies to add accent and personality. A Volvo will always do that. I like that. I bought Volvos and save them for my daughters that are driving now, but concepts has changed and the little dingy looking car my neighbor's sun drives is probably safer than the Volvos we have.

Call me party pooper if you want. Either that car was used for rallies across Africa or the mechanic is having a lot of fuan billing you. I have 4 Volvos average 170,000 miles and never had that kind of trouble in one car.

Think of how low your cost per mile will be for the next 50K miles -- even lower! It sounds like you maintain your car well. If that's the case, I'd expect it to last well beyond 200K.

--
Jeff Pierce (Post back with your results... it's what makes this forum work.)

I'd keep it. Of course I just bought a '94 945t with 113,000m for my wife. I've already put front brakes on it and will do the rears next week. The car had been very well maintained by it's previous owner. The darn thing looks showroom new under the hood and is solid underneath too.

If you learn to do some of the work yourself these are VERY inexpensive cars to keep and run tens of thousands of miles with. We just got back from a 1,400 mile round trip to Roanoke in complete comfort. I'm 6'1" and there isn't another newer car I could buy for $3,000 that I can stretch my legs out completely once the cruise is on.

Mileage averaged about 24mpg and the car used 1/2 qt of oil on the trip cruising between 65 and 75, up and down the mountains. We're moving to Roanoke and I wish I could take my '88 745t but three Volvos would be overkill with the company supplying me a 4x4.

Keep the car and drive it more.

Erwin in Memphis

'95 855T 150,000
'94 945T 113,000
'88 745T 203,000

I'll tell you what I told my mailman when he asked the other day about getting a brick for his son (I guess maybe the two 740s and a 940 in my driveway made him think I might know.)

I said that they are fantastic cars for teens (like mine), but that unless he or his son would be willing to do most of the maintenance on it themselves, he should get a Toyota instead.
--
Andy in St. Paul

Hey Markus,

Keep the car but rethink putting bilsteins on it. I put HD's on my 740 and got sick of them pretty quickly. The roads around here (east NC) are not so good and those stiff shocks are beating the hell out of me, the car and my wife. She has to pee about every 30 miles! I don't drive the car very much or I would have put in something softer by now. My 940 about needs new struts/shocks and I will go with something close to stock. You can change these yourself with a manual and the FAQ's. Borrow the spring compressors from an auto parts store. Take your time and be carefull and save $$$.

Blistein makes a softer, touring, strut/shock for our cars, I think, but I have no experience with them. Maybe someone else will comment on that. Maybe that's what you have in mind now.

On smooth roads the HD's are fine and with IPD bars the car handles pretty good- just around here it's not fun anymore.

my 2 cents,
cl

--
1988 745t 159k mi, 1995 945 123k mi

It's 13 years old and has 136,000 miles on it. I'd unload that thing tomorrow and buy a brand new Saturn.

JUST KIDDING!

The value of the car is irrelevant. The only value in any car is in the job it can do.

Even if you buy a brand spanking new one, take it into the dealer for a first service, pay the bill and the thing is still depreciating like crazy.

My own 940 turbo is at similar mileage to yours, and it managed in excess of 11000 miles in two months between may sixth and July sixth, I know what I'll do with mine, keep servicing it religeously, because nothing new will beat its running cost when I factor in depreciation.

The fault in your logic, I think is to say the car is only worth $3500 on the market.

That may be true... however, it'd be damned hard to find another car with the same intrinsic value for $3500. A second hand Ford Fiesta maybe? LOL!

You've easily got another 100k left on this car.

All cars need the same maintenance stuff at some point.

You guys have actually got me to imagine doing some of this work myself. Probably a good thing for me to mentally get my head around. I'm guessing that chinese-made floor jacks and jack stands wouldn't be all that expensive. I could even afford a new set of sockets. And get a maintenance manual to help walk me through the rear shocks. Then I'd only be paying for the front struts.

Now you are thinking!

The Harbor Freight stuff will get stuff done-- get a set of 1/2" impact sockets and an 18" breaker bar and a 3 ton floor jack-- it will cost you less than an hour of labor at a shop and you will probably never wear any of it out doing occasional work. Great to have for seasonal tire changes, etc. too...

Get a few successes under your belt and you may find yourself springing for a modest compressor and air impact tools. They are cheaper than you might think!

Good luck!

--
Herb Goltz, Aurora, Ontario, Canada '92 245 140K mi, '92 945t 210K mi

My wife and I have had the same conversation over the past few years. I bought my 93 940 at 130,000 miles and it now has 327,000 miles. There is a lot of miles left in your car regardless of what the resale value is. I finally set up a spreadsheet to balance a new car payment against repairs. Mostly to get my wife off my case. I am way ahead.

If you are worried about cost and don't do the work yourself, I would skip the Bilsteins and put in Boges. Then again, you could probably get another 30K on the current shocks.

Trans mount, easy if you have a floor jack.

good luck

Good lord, that is nothing. I'd wrap it all up for $500 (Bils+seals+tanny mount), write off the weekend and smuggly acknowledge that I saved a bundle, have no car payments and still have a great ride.

Sounds like you are pretty handy and experienced. I do count myself lucky for not having a car payment and having a pretty nice ride. Are the transmission mounts hard to DIY?

P.S. Don't wait on the seeping oil seals behind the timing belt-- that can end badly-- ask me how I know!

Good luck!
--
Herb Goltz, Aurora, Ontario, Canada '92 245 140K mi, '92 945t 210K mi

Herb,

Thanks for that tip. Helps me prioritize better.

The tranny mount is pretty easy-- I bought one from FCPgroton.com and put it in without drama-- you just need to support the tranny at the pan with a padded jack, then pull down the crossmember.

Shocks are easy DIY, struts not so simple. In any case, if you buy a newer used car you will be in for shocks and struts on that one eventually anyhow, so it doesn't seem sensible to ditch the car because of them.

You've dropped a lot of cash on parts already-- if you sell now, you will be gifting all that work to some lucky buyer. The car has low miles too. I'd keep it...

Good luck!

--
Herb Goltz, Aurora, Ontario, Canada '92 245 140K mi, '92 945t 210K mi

The shocks and struts are an easy DIY- with your model though I belive that you will need to realign the front end after doing the struts. Don't go for Blisteins-KYB are damn good enough for that car -you have the car in good shape now really and it should go another 150k miles with no problem. I would fix the seals that are leaking(check you flame trap)and do the shocks and then ride the car for years to come. I know people get tired of riding the same car over time but I really don't think you can find a more balanced vehicle as these 900 series cars are. If you do your paying out big bucks for them. I switched over to BMW when it came time to buy new again and wish to this day I could buy the Volvo 900 series again new instead of what I have.
Poolman