Hope this is not old hat but I have heard mention on the web (wikipedia for instance) that "The Volvo 745 had some severe problems with the C-pillar that could break in collisions even at relatively low speeds." What's the story?

Bill

I am a firefighter, and we have cut up a couple of hundred cars at drills over the last 25 years.

Last year, we cut up a couple of 240s, and the guys were really impressed, several said to mt "So THAT'S why you drive Volvos!"

One crew had occasion to cut up a 740 at another town's drill, and they complained about cutting the pillars. We seldom cut C pillars, and it is difficult for me to figure that they are anywhere as important as A and B pillars in an accident.

The Vanagon crash is interesting, but it is impossible to make any legitimate conclusion about the Volvo except that it did what it did. How did other cars fare in the same collision - MUCH WORSE? What?

What sort of collisions break C pillars?
--
'96 855R,'64 PV544 driver, '67 P1800 basket case, '95 855, '95 854, the first three are mine, heh, heh, 435,000 miles put on 9 bricks

Your experience matches what most of us on this forum believe to be true. That is why I asked the question about the C-pillar weakness statement. It seems to be at odds to experience. No doubt any design can be improved and no doubt that the 940 with SIPS is an improvement over the 740. But I understood SIPS is based on strengthening the floor (and roof?) at the B-pillar area so that side impact loads are absorbed by more of the overall structure. I suppose the C-pillar area could be part of the overall system but I doubt it is the major part.

Anyway, either the wikipedia statement should be substantiated or it should be removed.

Bill

SIPS (side impact protection system) is structural protection that has been in Volvo's since the '73 140's. One major feature is a strong steel tube as a protective barrier across the lower 3rd of the doors. It also integrates with the structural integrity of the A/B/C pillars by virtue of the door/pillar interface design (not the least of which are the hinges and door lock mechanism). This helps maintain the integrity of the passenger cage in both a side impact and frontal/rear impact. The doors are less likely to fold into a "V" and detach from the pillars/rocker/roof so the crumple zones are kept in front of and behind the passenger cage. It's one of the major reasons passengers in Volvo's are often able to get out and walk away from a serious accident when others are badly injured. There may have been improvements along the way, but I haven't noticed them when I've been poking around in my 700/900 doors. Mind you I don't go looking for structural changes, I just assume Volvo is always moving forward in that regard. Prior to SIPS, Volvo made its claim to safety fame with 3-point seat belts. The next step after SIPS was SRS -initially driver then passenger air bags then pyrotechnically tightened seat belts and then side air bags which didn't appear until the later 960's and S/V90's and of course the FWD's. Recent models are even more sophisticated when it comes to crash protection, but considering the age of our RWD vehicles we can at least rest a little easy.

Since I appear to have climbed onto my soap box, I'll add that honing your defensive driving skills is, in my not so humble opinion, one of the most important things you can do to protect yourself and your passengers by avoiding and minimizing accidents in the first place (plus your beloved car is less likely to get written off). If I had my way, a defensive driving course with actual experience on a simulator plus a refresher every 5 years or so should be a mandatory part of licensing. I don't care so much that someone has mastered parallel parking and can interpret road symbols for deer crossings. If someone can't figure out a railway crossing and gets smucked, well maybe that's just thinning the herd. What I care more about is their ability to handle a car under all kinds of real world conditions in a manner safe to both myself and themselves. Sorry to carry on like that, I've just been noticing a lot of really bad drivers lately.
--
Dave -940's, prev 740/240/140/120 You'd think I'd have learned by now

To me, anything posted on wikipedia should be taken with a dose of salt.
Regardless of the subject matter, be it VOLVOs or blenders.
--
Tom - '60 544, '68 220S, '70 145S, '86 745T, '06 Mazda MPV

Thought I had better quote my source. It is
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volvo_Cars#Three-numbered_Volvos
Do a ctrl-F and search on the word "pillar". That entry refers to its source as
http://www.vanagon.com/info/safety/volvo-crash/ which has nothing to do with the C-Pillar. In that test it is not surprising that the Volvo did not compare well against the VW van. Kind of like a moose coming in your windshield.

Hmmm...

Bill

hello
i havent heard that one, but if you get a chance talk to some firemen or rescue people and see what they say about car wrecks.
usually the volvo will be brought up.
good luck
mike