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I bought and limped home a 67 wagon, and it sat for while (3 months), replaced some things, and now I DONT get a spark at the plugs, and only a weak spark from the coil. My guess is an ignition system short somewhere caused by me. It will need to be timed and carb adjusted, etc. before I can drive it, but at this point A GOOD SPARK AT THE PLUGS is what I am after!
I have replaced:
battery (good brand, Les Schwab)
coil (generic)
cap/rotor/points/condensor/wires (upgrade) and plugs (all IPD)
Somewhere along they way I think I screwed it up. I chekced to see if the points spring was touching the dist. body, and thought I got all the felt washers back on right...does anyone know the correct order of the washers/spring points/condensor assembly?
Any other hints/diagnostics I should check out?
I still have the original coil (the "armored cable" one), and all the bits and peices that were on the car, if anyone thinks I sould test something out...
THANKS!!!
Brian
Ownership Chronology: '74 145 (Mabel), '85 245DL (Simon), '81 245T (Phoenix), '83 244GL (Brownie), and currently: '67 120 estate (Mitch)
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Another thing that buffaloed me a time or two was deteriorated insulating washers
where the screw goes through the distributor wall to carry current from the coil
primary to the points. That is a prime location for an ignition short.
I ended up getting some plastic washers and plastic tube to renew the insulation
and solved the problem. Prior to that it was graveyard dead.
I imagine that somewhere along the way you could get a resistance short so that
you might get some spark but not a strong one. To check it turn the engine to where
the points are open, disconnect the wire to the coil and test it with an ohmmmeter.
It should be way up in the megohms or "infinite".
This problem will be much worse in a wet climate.
--
George Downs, Bartlesville, Heart of the USA!
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Brian,
Use a jumper wire directly to the coil from the battery; that way you know you've got voltage there regardless of anything else going on. Pull a plug and ground it so you can see the spark. What do you have now? If it is still weak, you can remove the jumper; the problem is not the supply to the coil -- turn your attention to the points and the secondary. If the spark was healthy, turn your attention to the feed circuit. Continuing as necessary, pull the coil wire and use a screw driver to cause the spark to jump to the block. That may be a bit vague; what you want is to see the spark from the distributor end of the coil wire as a helper (or you with a remote switch) turn the engine over. Careful, it can bite the SH** out of you. Got spark? That would verify the points are operational -- look to the distributor cap and wires. No spark; lift the condensor lead off the points. Does it spark now? No; your points or the wire is grounded or a low resistance to ground. Yes; the condensor is kaput.
Besides all that, do you have the correct coil? A low resistance (below 3 Ohms) primary will require a ballast resistor. If the coil primary reads 3-4 Ohms, no ballast is required. A coil that requires no ballast but has a ballast installed will produce weak spark.
I hope that helps some.
--
Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- (I've taken to using Mr. because my name tends to mislead folks on the WWW. I am a 52 year old fat man ;-) -- KD5QBL
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Brian;
George has given good info, Shannon has given good generic info, but unfortunately NOT APPLICABLE to your vehicle. Shannon's info is essentially to "hot wire" the car, and this is NOT POSSIBLE due to the armored cable which completely secures the supply side of IGN coil.
Here are my ultra-simple, Stevie Wonder approved instructions for getting started determining what the issue is with your IGN sys:
Checking for High Voltage generation:
1. Disconnect wire from coil (Neg) to points, disconnect high tension wire which normally connects to input (center) terminal of dist cap, and lay this with a spark gap, on valve cover.
2. Turn IGN ON. Alternately charge (by grounding the negative coil terninal) the coil primary (which is what closed points do normally), then discharging (by opening connection to ground, which is THE OTHER thing points normally do!), which SHOULD result in high voltage spark from across the spark gap made in 1.
If you get spark, shut OFF IGN and check continuity of points at dist to ground...they may not be opening AND closing...BOTH conditions are required! See George's advice...also the insulator behind the points spring can bocome dislodged, or break down electrically causing points connection to be permanently connected to ground with your symptoms...
See also: http://sw-em.com/Volvo%20Ignition%20from%20Scratch.htm#Vintage%20Volvo%20Ignition%20system%20and%20the%20Armored%20Cable
Good Hunting!
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Ron, he replaced the armored coil.
--
Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- (I've taken to using Mr. because my name tends to mislead folks on the WWW. I am a 52 year old fat man ;-) -- KD5QBL
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Shannon;
AAAAAAAHHHHHHH...I didn't get that out of my first reading, but NOW I DO!...I took that "generic coil" to mean OE and "I still have the coil with armored cable, etc." to mean that it was still installed, not that he had it in a box in the garage (in which case it's irrelevant to the symptoms on the car) ...so that means that Brian has installed a different coil (but he mentions nothing of a ballast resistor and how it is switched into and out of the primary circuit)...and now when it doesn't work, he is hoping someone here can figure out the mess he's in...I don't think that will be me...
Brian; At this point, I have no idea what you have after having changed it from the stock configuration, and I haven't gotten enough info from your post to know what you have...therefore can venture no guesses to help you figure out why its not working...if you are the engineer on your reconfigured IGN system, then its time to do some more engineering...
Good Hunting
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Thanks Ron. The only thing I did was cut the armored cable and install the replacement out of the box. I added nothing to the system (resistor or otherwise). I am going to try the old coil as suggested by others.
bg
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I would be suspect of wiring (where it goes through the distributor housing)or condenser (make sure it's well attached and/or try the old one).. if the coil doesn't help.
Or a points issue.. you didn't clean those with.. sandpaper.. did you? Have you check for spark *at the points*? Rotate engine to points closed position, ignition on, manually open and close the points manually using a stick or some other non-conductive thing. You should get a pretty strong spark at the points gap. If you don't, your coil may not be getting enough juice to produce a good hot spark at the plugs or the top center of the cap.
--
-Matt I ♥ my ♂
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Thanks guys,
Okay the update is that I rechecked the dist. screw/point spring/condenser short circuit option, and put some plastic on the screw, etc. Here's where I'm at:
I have (small) spark from the coil (at the distributor end of things)
I have spark from the #1 spark plug wire
I have NO SPARK when I plug in the plug!?!
Can I rule out a short? Can my brand new condensor be bad? What would give enough juice for a spark from the spark plug wire, but not enough to bridge the gap?
Thinking I'd try to adjust things to make it "easiest" for a spark to jump at the plug, I set the points and plugs gaps (within tolerance, of course) to their "lowest" setting (meaning small gap). If I am thinking right, the jolt to the plugs would be bigger since it had more time to build up, and the gap to cross at the plug electrode would be smaller, making it more likely to fire.
NOW WHAT???
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I have (small) spark from the coil (at the distributor end of things)
Put your old coil back on the car and see where that takes you. The reason it won't spark at the plug is the voltage is too low. The voltage is developed by the coil. If the points are opening and closing and you have weak but visible spark at the wire, they points are doing their job.
--
Mr. Shannon DeWolfe -- (I've taken to using Mr. because my name tends to mislead folks on the WWW. I am a 52 year old fat man ;-) -- KD5QBL
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