On my 1992 240. What is the list of things I need to buy from IPD to do the job and make it go as easy as possible?

Thanks,

Tom

My parts arrived from IPD today and I had the day off, so I dug into the project around 1:30PM. I was finished and all cleaned up by 5:30PM.

Things went remarkably well. To prep for the job I read the IPD instructions, the instructions in my Bentley manual, and took a tour of Art's cleanflametrap write-up.

I'm glad I ordered the bung tool.

Didn't have too much difficulty swapping out the old in-tank pump and hooking up the new one.

Had a little trouble getting the bung nut tightened all the way so I used a breaker bar to get more leverage and snugged it up all the way tight.

I re-used the original sender and I hope that isn't a mistake.

One of the fuel line clamps on the top of the sender unit crumbled apart when I was taking it off.

I was disappointed that the car idled terribly right after I got everything back together. The engine was running terribly and shaking really bad like it was having fuel problems and bucking. I checked and all four cylinders are getting spark.

I also installed a brand new air intake tube to the throttle body since the lousy aftermarket one I got from FCP Groton sheared off a nipple.

All seems fine for the moment. We'll see if the poor idle continues tomorrow morning. If so, I'm guessing it might be the HALL Sensor?

Tom

hello dan, art ben, devo and others interested in the intank pump installation. installed thenew unit today sat afternoon. used the 30R10 hose piece graciously contributed to my cause by devo. the bung nut tool worked fine. have to use a lot of torque to tighten it back up. used vaseline on the nut and top of the unit plate. used new fuel injector clamps on the little hose ends that are submerged. reused the old o ring reconnected the two in and out pipes and plugged the vent pipe. (think 92 was a closed system. have to be very careful when you unscrew the ground wire and the plastic cup holding up the pump to the sender- looks fragile. moment of truth came when the ignition switch was turned on and i heard the new pump hum and the the gas gauge worked for the first time(new sender). drove it around and everything seems fine and smooth. thought i read that when you did this job the engine ran rough as hell while the ecu/computer relearned stuff, but the engine ran perfectly on startup. now i have to put the 3d seat back in and all the secret panels. thanks tons for your help oldduke

Cool! glad it worked out
--
Dean 1991 240 wagon

Hi Tom,

First, if you have not already, make sure the new pump is working.

Then, check the OBD codes, and pull fuse 6 momentarily to reset and drive some to get the ECU to relearn. The crank sensor could need replacement (check the cable for cracks) but those symptoms really do sound like fuel symptoms. Go over that AMM hose and its clamps.
--
Art Benstein near Baltimore

Police were called to a day care where a three-year-old was resisting a rest.

the car idled terribly right after I got everything back together. The engine was running terribly and shaking really bad like it was having fuel problems and bucking

Was it doing this prior to the pre-pump replacement? If not, I would not go looking for problems elsewhere until after giving a little more attention to the pre-pump.

I don't know who makes ipd's pump, but there are inferior pumps out there for sale.
--
'80 DL 2 door, '89 DL Wagon

Yes, it has run terrible like that for the past month. It got worse when the air intake hose that goes from the amm to the throttle body ripped off a nipple. The check engine light came on and it kept stalling terribly.

When I turn the ignition key to position II I hear the fuel pump come on. But I'll look more into it like Art goes into on his website.

This morning it idled poorly and stumbled and eventually it smoothed out. But when I left my driveway the car first lacked power and was sputtering.

So I don't know what the problem is. I was hoping the in-tank pump would fix the problem, but it hasn't really. The new air intake hose has helped, but when the car is first started up after sitting a while it will idle poorly. But I have spark to all cylinders.

No check engine light today.

How difficult is it to replace that HALL sensor.

For fun I replaced some of the vacuum hoses today.

I also removed the IAC valve thing and cleaned it out. It didn't seem dirty at all.

On start-up it still surges and idles poorly. When I give it gas for a few minutes it smoothes out.

When the check engine light returns I'll post the codes.

Could it be a fuel pressure regulator problem?

13

Yeah, check your FPR. Pull off the vaccum hose and check for a heavy fuel smell. Speaking of fuel issues, have you changed your fuel filter? The new pump is running alright?

How's the O2 sensor?

I'm pretty sure I replaced the fuel filter within the last two years, but I'll check my records.

Still no check engine light yet, but the car runs poorly at start up. It stumbles, the engine shakes terribly, it idles poorly, and it lacks power for a while when first started up. It's like it is running too rich.

The codes it was throwing before were for the fuel mixture being too rich or too lean, then there was a code for fuel injector failure I think.

I did Art's testing with a paper clip where you pull fuse #4 and touch the right and left contacts independently with fuse #6. Both pumps buzzed to life when jumped independently.

I have not checked the fuel pressure regulator yet or the fuel pump relay.

Oxygen sensor is original as far as I know, so it is OLD!

Sounds like it could be a bad Fuel Pressure Reg. with all the shaking etc.

Possibly a bad O2 sensor, but those usually throw an O2 sensor code and maybe a fuel code too. You can do a quick visual check of the wires condition where the plug attaches to the cat or downpipe.

When bad, either one can make an engine run rich.

When my Fuel Pump Relay died my car simply wouldn't start. Pull it and look for scorching etc.

Just for sh*ts and grins make sure your AMM plug is secure in its connector....

Last night I checked around and the oxygen sensor is still there and the wires look fine.

I pulled the vacuum hose off the fuel pressure regulator and all seemed fine. No fuel spilled out of it. I sniffed and it sorta smelled a little like gas, but I wouldn't call it a strong gas smell.

I looked around at the induction speed sensor pick-up on the top of the bell housing and really couldn't see it clearly at all. Man that is a tight space in there.

At this point I'm going to throw in a new oxygen and speed sensor pick-up and see if any improvement is noted.

After that I'll replace the fuel pressure regulator next.

It's your car, but IMHO, I wouldn't rush to replace anymore parts.

A few more thoughts...

Sounds like your fuel pressure regulator is probably okay. A little gas smell is normal. Personally, I wouldn't rush to replace it since its north of $40 bucks new. Maybe try and switch with a used one to test it. I have a used one if you are interested.

The O2 sensor should throw an 02 sensor code if its bad. However, yours might be old and weak and not performing well.

Yes, replacing that speed sensor looks like lots of fun! I've never replaced one, but if I recall correctly, the (rpm) speed sensor bolts can come loose. Check those first. I don't believe a bad one can make a car run rich. I think it prevents the car from starting. Maybe can cause stalling too.

BTW - It wouldn't hurt to check all your vacuum lines before replacing anything else. Grab a tube or stethoscope to check the vacuum lines, then listen closely along the length of your intake manifold gasket for a hissing sound. A bad intake manifold gasket will make your car run like crap and the engine will indeed shake.

The intake gasket in my 90 went bad and I couldn't find the problem/leak until my car started sounding like a jet...:)

J

Replaced the oxygen sensor this evening and the engine still shakes like crazy. Rough idle still.

Checked over the vacuum hoses and air intake again, with no troubles found.

No check engine light or engine codes.

I'm at a loss.

Exhaust smells kinda like gasoline.

I'm very frustrated.

Ah, one final thought tonight. I replaced my in-tank pump because my car had a "miss" in one cylinder. I was certain it was the pump. Turned out it was a defective spark plug. If you haven't already, check you plugs and the other tune-up parts.

BTW - My plugs were almost new...

Hi,


I would perform a condition test first. Why replace parts without reason?

What is the compression? Can you post a YouTube video? What is the fuel pressure?


Goatman

Did you check the intake manifold gasket? Leaks there can be hard to find. A hissing sound.

"Exhaust smells kinda like gasoline."
It does sound like it is running rich. To me that points to a bad fuel pressure regulator or a leaky intake mainfold gasket. There should be a fuel code I would think....

Just a long shot here, but check the fuel lines from the sending unit to the main pump to make sure everything is in order. You might also consider going back into the tank to check everything there as well.

Check out the link below. It's for 700/900 series cars but almost everything applies to 240's too. A helpful diagnosis tool. There might be something good in there...:)

http://www.brickboard.com/FAQ/700-900/FuelSystem.htm

Hey, it also wouldn't be a bad idea to start a new post to see if you get any fresh input on your problem.

Good Luck!

Hi,


A leaky intake will cause lean running.


Goatman

Hello,

I had a bad intake manifold gasket. The car ran rich. See Dan Marino's latest post for an in-depth explanation from Art and Lucid.

Jim

Dan,


Please post the OBD I code.


Goatman

hi sages- finally have all the parts and will be doing the same job this afternoon. keeping in mind your experience with the bad idle, i will check the operation of the pump, notonly for working when energized but also for turning in the right direction. figure i will hook it all up then put a spare hose on the outflow nipple of the sender and see if it pumps out gas into a can or bottle. smart approach? what say you folks? oldduke

If you haven't read Art's write up on tank pumps and sending units you might want to spend a few minutes doing so.

See: http://cleanflametrap.com/transferPump.htm.

As for testing the pump, I will defer to Art, who will, hopefully, see your question and advise.

You, know, I was also going to do a tank pump replacement today but, like a fool, I filled the tank this morning without considering that this can sometimes result in fuel being expelled when you open the lock ring. So I think I'll wait a few days.
--
'80 DL 2 door, '89 DL Wagon

If replacing the fuel gauge sender -- and you almost might as well if you can swing it, since you don't want to have to go in there again soon -- my advice is to go with the highest quality unit you can. I see IPD sells a VDO sender and one marked "aftermarket". I did a cheap one a few years ago, and the resistance curve is awful. The gauge now takes a good while to get to 1/2, then drops like a rock.

And add me to the list who suggests getting the bung nut tool. I didn't, wanting to save $24 bucks rather than buying a tool I'd only use once. I ended up spending that and more through my abject failure to get the nut off, my breakage and subsequent replacement of old, corroded fixtures, and my having to have a shop finish the job.

--EdM.
--
'90 240DL Wagon 'Lola' -- '72 1800ES 'Galadriel'

a bung nut tool certainly makes the job easier. i did it last time with a hammer and a screwdriver. it was kind of a pain.
maybe if you'd won a super bowl you wouldn't have to do all the work on your 20 year old volvo yourself ;)

I did the best I could. You've got to remember that I'm from Pittsburgh, so I'm as dumb as a box of rocks. :)

Did I mention that I hate Joe Montana?

13

I ordered the fuel pump replacement kit from IPD that I think will take care of it. I also ordered the bung tool to make that easier to deal with.

I replaced one on my 90 quite some time ago. As I recall, there is short rubber hose attached to the pump that is prone to deterioration. It wouldn't hurt to replace that sock as well while you are in there. Those parts are quite cheap. I think the pump, hose and sock were less than $40 from FCP Groton.

Before starting the job remove the cover and check the condition of your fuel sending unit. I discovered that the sending unit was pretty badly rusted where it screws into the tank. So ended up doing both the sending unit and the pump. Of course rust might not be such an issue where you are as it is here in New England!

Be careful you dont knock off the float ball either!
--
Dean 1991 240 wagon

Really the only thing to need to have on hand is a bung nut removal tool and a plastic bag. Well that and a well ventilated area to work in. The fumes are what are explosive so you want them to dissipate quickly.

Be gentle when you lift out the old assembly you don't want to knock that old sock off.

Really a straight forward job.

Good Luck and Regards,

Paul

I believe Art Benstein uses this wrench http://www.doitbest.com/Plumbers+tools+and+joint+wrench-Cobra+Products+Inc-model-PST152-doitbest-sku-407429.dib

with a large adjustable wrench to turn the plumbers wrench, which turns the bung nut. Then, the tool isn't used for just one function in life like the IPD bung nut tool. It can be used on.... plumbing stuff too!!

Also, used canned air, or compressed air to blow the crap out of the recess where the unit sits. Try to keep the area clean as possible.

And finally, I found it impossible to use the large new (too fat/thick) O-ring that comes with the new pump/sender unit. I just finally gave up after an hour and used the old one which was in fine shape, also, I think one of the fuel lines attatched to sender unit is the shrink wrap kind of fuel line that you have to cut off with a razor knife and re-attatch with a short piece of fuel injection line and fuel injection type hose clamps. This is the return line from the engine and has little or no pressure in it.

Hi Jeff,

I haven't yet tried the plumber's wrench on the tank bung. I have used a basin wrench to loosen a heater hose, but on the tank bung I got lucky when I looked around the house for a suitable spanner tool and found this to fit perfectly.

One advantage of having something like this tool, or the purpose-made (correct) tool, is you can put some downward force while turning, to aid in getting the tapered fingers of the lock ring engaged while compressing the O-ring for a good seal. I supposed it could be done with the crossed screwdrivers, but a lot depends on the surgeon's coordination, skill, and patience, working through that barely adequate incision.





(Taken from In the Tank)
--
Art Benstein near Baltimore

A dog teaches a boy fidelity, perseverance, and to turn around three times before lying down. -Robert Benchley