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Hi All,
Today the car just cranked and cranked with no start.
I had a post about this a few months ago and it's been starting
immediately like clockwork since.
This time I remembered to check OBD codes first
and found on Port-2: 1-2-1 MAF (AMM) signal missing or faulty
I unhooked the battery for 10 seconds and reconnected.
ECU reset
And zing the car started, and I wasn't late for my appointment.
I had paid close attention to the AMM connector and switched from
dielectric silicone to Penetrox there, and all seemed stable.
The AMM connector pins looked good to the evil eye.
Then I had to remove the air box to replace the washer pump and had the
AMM connector apart again.
Is this a connector problem or a funky ECU?
Something forces the ECU to fail, maybe a funky connector
Maybe old and tired out of limit caps in the ECU?
But rebooting the ECU resets back to happy motoring,
at least for a while.
Keep a 10MM swivel head gear wrench around for good luck.
Go figure, Bill
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Hi Bill. My vote is a flaky AMM, either internal or an intermittent connection. Peel back the boot and push in all pins. Next time you get a no-start, simply disconnect the AMM and if it now restarts (in limp home mode) then that's almost certain confirmation.
Also, next time you try to point a finger at the ECU, try to be a bit more refined in your diagnosis. By removing power at the battery you're resetting both the ECU and ignition controller (both data and capacitor charges) so you're actually pointing four fingers. First off, reset just the OBD section at the diagnostic connector. Reset just port 6 for the ignition side first then try a restart before a reset on port 2 for the fuel side. If neither makes a difference then selectively reset just the ignition controller or just the ECU using their fuses. Pulling power to clear things like the fuel trim program data should make no difference to starting, only returning to initial running conditions using default values.
I know you like thinking outside the box, sometimes to the point of seemingly grasping at straws, so with that kind of thinking I'll mention that after disconnecting the battery to remove power to all controllers and let capacitors discharge in the controllers, you are also letting the battery have a moment to recover a tiny bit of charge and when reconnecting there will also be a micro voltage surge that *in theory* could make a tiny difference in marginal connections -I'm thinking broken wire strands, weak connector contacts, weak grounds and marginal solder joints (thermal stress fractures) where signals might now be marginally okay, like from the AMM.
--
Dave -still with 940's, prev 740/240/140/120 You'd think I'd have learned by now
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Hi Dave,
> My vote is a flaky AMM either internal or an intermittent connection.
Have you taken the cover off the AMM to see the guts? Is there a circuit
board and possible cold solder joints inside?
> AMM...Peel back the boot and push in all pins.
Is there an issue with AMM connectors? They are not Bullet connectors.
I dunno if resetting OBD codes will do the same as resetting all ECU memory
You can't selectively reset fuel and ignition ECU's with fuses since they
are both on Fuse 1, a very busy fuse for engine management.
But pulling Fuse 1 might be easier than disconnecting the battery,
Pulling Fuse 1 is a good idea for the next unscheduled no start event, but not until I check for OBD codes first. I can test your theory that resetting the
OBD code or codes will reset the no start condition.
The more info we get the better.
I wonder if the code was there before the no start?
I got no check engine idiot light on any of these events.
>Next time you get a no-start, simply disconnect the AMM and if it now restarts (in limp home mode) then that's almost certain confirmation.
Far out! I can try that, but don't expect it will reboot the ECUs.
Or, if there's something serviceable inside the AMM, I can look for a crappy
solder joint maybe? What's under the cover with the 4 flathead phillips screws?
Cheers, Bill
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I'm not sure if 10 seconds would reset the fuel maps, but it does reset the recent record of how far off from expected the O2 sensor readings and AMM are from what they should be. The ECU only has the O2 sensor to compare the AMM values with, so it may blame one when the other is the problem.
I would check your O2 voltage swing and make sure it isn't weak. You should see a swing from 0.1V (lean) all the way to 0.9V (rich) roughly every 1-2 seconds and it should swing quickly between the 0.3 and 0.7 range.
You should also check for intake leaks and fix any exhaust leaks.
A quicker test is to disconnect the AMM and try to drive with it unhooked. Do NOT disconnect or reconnect the AMM within 2 minutes of shutting off the engine. The ECU does a burn-off of the hot wire and the current is high enough that it may damage the ECU especially when disconnected.
My bet is that the AMM actually is bad and you're just in the "kind of bad" zone between working great and obviously wrong the minute the ECU reads it. Once the ECU collects enough data saying that the AMM is bad, it throws the code.
Good luck!
Wil
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Hi Will,
I appreciate the comments.
I see black soot around the tail pipe with no visible black exhaust, and get
lousy gas mileage so maybe the O2 sensor is off.
Where do I probe the voltage? I'm assuming it needs to remain plugged in.
>You should also check for intake leaks.
You mean vacuum leaks, can I use a vacuum gauge to check vacuum health?
any pointers?
> and fix any exhaust leaks. I don't hear any tell-tale noise in the exhaust
You suspect the AMM is bad, I have a 740 AMM in my parts stash here,
dunno if it's compatible with 1993 B230FT: Bosch 0 280 212 016
That number is not shown in my Volvo pocket data book.
The book says look for 2.5-4.0 ohms between pins 2 & 3
The spare reads 3.9 ohms, I'll measure the one in the car tomorrow.
Is there a circuit board or anything serviceable under the cover with 4 flathead
Phillips screws. I don't want to break a possible good spare to investigate.
See my reply to Porkface where today I popped a RPM sensor code after a stall,
A6 2-1-4 I didn't disconnect battery, just cleared the code.
Thanks, Bill
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I've had intake manifold gaskets go bad. Starter fluid sprayed around the gasket confirmed the issue by the engine speeding up. Or a hose up to the ear listening for a hissing sound.
Probably not your issue but I got a rich lean code by installing the oxygen sensor
in the wrong location. Installed in the converter and not the down pipe.
The timeline of how long to disconnect the batterie is a mystery to me. I read a post where someone would leave the batterie disconnected for 20 minutes as a solution. I believe them but what is the ecu doing in that time?
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back when i was doing this everyday, 121 means it needs a mass meter, no ground signal to the fuel pump relay meant it needs an ecu. i really,REALLY doubt you have an ecu problem. 121 pops again , do that diagnosis.
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Hi Porkface,
Thanks for the comments.
This is the third event where it refused to start and was repaired by
disconnecting the battery for ten seconds.
The good news is I didn't need a tow home, and it's working normally.
The bad news is it's an intermittent fault and hard to troubleshoot.
Is there any history of flaky solder joints in AMM's?
How do you account for the repair by disconnecting the battery?
The AMM gets it's 12V from the main fuel relay. I'll test my new Lisle
relay puller scheduled to get here Saturday, and pull the fuel relay
and check each socket pin to see if it's tight, brush a little Penetrox
on each pin, reinsert, rub the beads and see what happens. If I find
a loose pin, it might be paydirt.
The next time it quits I'll check for OBD codes and see if 1-2-1 pops again.
Others might try disconnecting the battery if their car suddenly cranks but
wont start. That's where the 10MM wrench comes in, and it beats a tow.
Cheers, Bill
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by disconnecting the battery, you're resetting the adaptation of the ecu. it forgets it's bad habits and all is well. until the running of the engine skews the adaptations from whatever id posting bad info to the ecu.. because you get 121, i suspect the amm. search this site, i've posted amm diagnosis here before. just not committed to memory any more
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Hi Porkface,
Today while parking the engine stalled, but it started right up.
Stalling at lights happened before about when it decided not to start.
I checked OBD codes and this time A6 2-1-4 RPM signal missing sporadically.
Another clue.
On a Hunch, I put a snap ferrite on the CPS harness and slid it down to the bell housing where the CPS shield is ungrounded. The ferrite is a choke to high frequency Trash/noise (EMI) from the ignition and alternator.
There's a ground wire to the bell housing but the CPS ground (shield)is not connected to the bell housing, which seems strange to me.
Gotta check that bell housing ground connection the next time the car is on a lift.
Volvo and Indy techs swapped out new OEM CPS several times to address the quitting without solving the long term issue. It's hard to fix something
that looks like it's OK.
Long time pro mechanics avoid after market CPS, maybe because after market CPS
use cheap un-plated connectors and cheap shielding. Quality of shielding in
coaxial cable varies widely and the good stuff, 98% copper braid, is pricey.
Couple that with weak filter capacitors (from aging) in the ECU and maybe that's what's going on. The RPM counter circuit may be upset with noise.
Why it works and suddenly quits in several month intervals is a mystery.
Resetting the ECU to fix is a big clue that the ECU is part of the problem
along with possible flaky inputs.
Best regards, Bill
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i never saw 214 mentioned. every bad crank sensor i replaced for a no start never posted 214-never. i scope them to be sure. the only time 1 saw a 214 was when the reluctor ring on the flex plate got dinged by a 6mm bolt banging around inside the bellhousing. scope screen on that was really wonky-hence the 214.
it could also be a reaction to the flywheel as it reacts to misfires. if the ecu can't make sense of what it's seeing from the crank sensor, it'll post a code. never had any bosch car-volvo, mercedes, etc.-that posts a crank sensor code when it's dead and has no signal. i'd love to hang a scope on that and watch what happens.
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How do you check the CPS with a scope?
Where do you hook up the probes?
Can you remove the boot on the connector to probe there?
What waveform is normal.
I'm especially interested if there's Ignition/alternator RF Trash on top of some normal square wave output from the CPS.
Bill
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iirc, it's a sawtooth with a flat spot for tdc about 500mv ac. get a wiring diagram, i think it's pins 1 and 2 that's the signal.
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Hi Bill,
Dave Barton uses Penetrox and OxGard as Ron Kwas does.
https://www.240turbo.com/headlightrelay.html
http://www.sw-em.com/anti_corrosive_paste.htm
Dave Batron has LED headlight info here:
https://www.240turbo.com/headlight.html
I dunno the pins, yet you check for continuity between two of the three pins on the crank position sensor (CPS) connector.
Did you treat this with penetrox, with the zinc particles in it? I can't find out whether the penetrox grease is conductive or not. You use stuff like that in medium and high volt applications, like ground plates inside an OSP cabinet with power transmitters in it for cell, microwave, and such.
These wire harness connectors use pins or jack that are tinned atap copper alloy. You want no metal particles constantly debridingn (scratching) the tin plate atop the copper alloy. Also, is the carrier lubricant conductive or not? If yes, you can short out the AMM connecting pins. With DeoxIT-D, it's dielectric, so you can apply across the connector or ECU pins and reconnect. Same thing for any low volt DC conductor or harness carrying low volt, low AMP DC and signal, like the engine control wire harness and connected sensors.
The AMM/MAF can fail in Volvo as the preheater flappy valve in the air filter box. Fails to all hot all the time and prevents ambient cool air to enter. Replace the air temp thermostat (Borg Warner WAhler 70411) or remove the preheat assembly for a cold air intake. What I did. Mileage can suffer in extreme cold.
http://www.v8volvo.se/mekartips/volvo/
Time for a digital multi meter and test through the harness?
The 700-900 FAQ includes most of the test info with a DMM.
Wiring diagrams.
Here as Oz Volvo.
https://ozvolvo.org/archive/
Use browser web page search for:
Find the
Taliessin Penfound - TP32352-1 1993 240 Wiring Diagrams.pdf
PDF page 20 item D. Show all three CPS wires connect to the harness. So continuity across 1 and 2. It is not a power sensor, Just an impulse sender. Did you treat this ocnnector with penetrox?
I use eggnog to halt corrosion. By the bucket! Moar eggnog!
Happy Fryday during the moar eggnog holidayze!
--
Give your brickboard.com a big thumbs up! Way up! - Roger Ebert & Gene Siskel
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Hello there "Eggnog Kid"
>I dunno the pins, yet you check for continuity between two of the three pins on >the crank position sensor (CPS) connector.
volvo nr coil ohms Inductance mH
-1991 1389399 240 +-25 55 +-10 (10 kHz)
-1991- 3547847 170 +-30 44 +-15 (10 kHz)
pins 1 & 2 coil Pin 3 Gnd
>Did you treat this with penetrox, with the zinc particles in it? I can't find >out whether the penetrox grease is conductive or not.
I switched the CPS and AMM connector lube from dielectric silicone to Penetrox, and it is not conductive. I'm guessing all the bad reports about after market CPS being rubbish might be shoddy unplated connectors and crappy shielding.
This week I placed a snap ferrite designed for larger RG-8/ RG-213 coax
on the CPS harness and slid it down to the bell housing. The CPS is NOT grounded to the grounded bell housing... seems like a Volvo oversight.
I've emailed Palomar Engineers for any suggestions of extra shielding for
CPS and AMM harnesses and haven't heard back yet. The intermittent weirdness could be from strong RF nearby getting on a poorly shielded CPS or AMM harness.
>I use eggnog to halt corrosion. By the bucket! Moar eggnog!
Whoa! Santa, too much eggnog and you'll look like Mr. Creosote!
>Happy Fryday during the moar eggnog holidayze!
Amen, Bill
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Ahoy Eggnog fan,
>So no CPS connection to ground at where the 10mm bolt head screw at the bell housing bracket and through the wire harness? I only recall the pickup coil CPS connector pinout for 1 and 2 t6ransceive signal with the wire harness and ECU. A floating ground, then? Some RF protection in the cable sheath?
I was surprised that there's no grounding of the CPS shield at the bell housing.
My sense is that poor shielding is a problem with some CPS. Hard to confirm
with failures spread out over weeks or months. I wonder about crappy bell housing grounds.. Does anyone ever service them?
Countermeasures for RFI on critical ECU inputs: CPS, AMM, Knock sensor
and Power stage control lines all shielded by Volvo can be snap ferrites
or added aluminum foil over the harnesses. Snap ferrites act as RF chokes.
Leaving the CPS shield un-grounded at the bell housing makes no sense to me.
Did you see the AMM FAQ from JDPorsche? There's another interesting subject.
Did you try some LED headlights yet?
BTW: KlausC is beating the odds, he just had cataract surgery on both eyes and is doing well, gaining weight and making blood platelets on his own.
I told him to fire Hospice, ask Mayo Clinic for a refund, and move to Canada to get better doctors.
Happy New Year, Bill
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Hi Bill,
Not yet. I found my 1991 240 has corrosion at ground collection that use a screw or bolt to secure to the plate or sheet metal. I did this service like in 2012 on all three 240s and all ran much better with better throttle response and improved fuel economy.
The (Penn?) Sylvannia silver star 9004 / HB1 I got like three years before were bright at first, yet have dimmed. A twist, use oil squirt, and tighten does the job. I also have ground straps between the unibody and exhaust at hanger unions.
The CPS cable does not connect to ground on 740 with EZK116. There is a cable shield sheath from the sensor end to the cable connector. I'm not sure right now, tho. The CPS connector end has three pins. Also, the distance between the sensor and the ideal center point may need some file use on Bougicord. Maybe it is better. Never had to before when replaced in 2009 on 1991 or 1990.
Auld, flea-infested owld brain cells. May have had too much ayyyyyyyg naaaawg. Makes up well with a giant glass of the strongly brewed earl grey tea. Earl grey tea and Eggnog! Helps with the type II Wilford Brimley's diabeetus.
You can test for continuity of ohms resistance and wiggle the cabel to see if there is a break in a conductor therein. I'll guess you tested that already.
I doubt there is something generating RF powerful enough in your 900. A gauss field meter, I guess it is called? The bulk head plate steel does some farrady cage match electrical engineering action between the engine bay and the under the dash stuff, I guess. There exist two maker of the CPS cable. Bougicord and another. If any damage like the oft described outsheath failure, exposing a light colorful and iridescent foil. If anything makes RF noise it is the alternator, HVAC blower, and I dunno. It'd take a lot of noise to interfere with signal or low volt DC carried in stranded copper alloy conductor used in the wiring harness.
At FCP Euro, much closer to you then iPd and also 10$ cheaper (copy and paste URL):
https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/volvo-reference-sensor-rpm-240-740-760-780-940-271949
So the other some say is okay is Made in Duetchland by Bremi for 31$:
https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/volvo-crankshaft-sensor-bremi-3547847
Volvo OEM (Bougicord?)
https://www.tascaparts.com/oem-parts/volvo-engine-crankshaft-position-sensor-271949
Has two spinning slips so the cable does not flop in teh breeze for 40 years!
I get these used at yunkyards and so have a collection of known goods CPS's in the truck and on a shelf should I ever have a garage again.
Spare ECUs or newer versions of ECUs your model can use helps as well as spare relays. I have a half dozen white fuel injection and other relays, merely reflow the solder, and add moar solder so welds do not crack again!
Easy to replace in the 700/900 engine bar! Sort of terrible in the 240 engine bay. The factory shop manual says 'pull the gear box' to replace this thing on 240.
Ha!
MacDuffy's Eggnog Tavern, now replete with moar eggnog!
Or buttermilk and giant loaves of fresh ultra sourdough!
SourDough Bread: Never sour enuff!!!

--
Give your brickboard.com a big thumbs up! Way up! - Roger Ebert & Gene Siskel
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Hi MacDuff,
>I found my 1991 240 has corrosion at ground collection that use a screw or bolt to secure to the plate or sheet metal. I did this service like in 2012 on all three 240s and all ran much better with better throttle response and improved fuel economy.
Which ground are you talking about here?
How did fuel economy suffer when it got squirrely?
> The (Penn?) Sylvannia silver star 9004 / HB1
Look here for some first class info from Brickboarder Ron Kwas:
http://www.sw-em.com/techarticles.htm
http://www.sw-em.com/Wiring%20Notes.htm#the_lowly_250_push_on_terminal
http://www.sw-em.com/Deoxit_D5_Additional.htm#my_recommendations
http://www.sw-em.com/voltage_drop_in_headlights_power_in_hex_connector.htm
Then ditch the halogens for better LED headlights
>I doubt there is something generating RF powerful enough in your 900.
Cars make lot's of RFI, plus RFI can come from external strong sources.
Here's an article about cleaning up noise so you can hear things better with a HF or VHF radio in a car, boat, or plane.
https://www.rfcafe.com/references/popular-electronics/eliminate-mobile-radio-noise-popular-electronics-june-1966.htm
This same noise can corrupt geriatric computers.
>Spare ECUs or newer versions of ECUs your model can use helps as well as spare relays. I have a half dozen white fuel injection and other relays, merely reflow the solder, and add moar solder so welds do not crack again!
Relays crap out with use and age. Solder isn't everything. If the solder melted, it's likely because the circuit has too much current. I'm not sure
if it's a fuel pump that starts drawing more current or if its loose main relay
socket pins that are the reason for too much current.
How much additional current flow for loose arcing relay socket pins?
(That cause the fuse block to crispy critter.)
The last poster that was blowing 30 amp fuses in 940 Fuse 1 couldn't bother to
measure current and/or look for loose pins and report back.
You should see 10.5 amps at fuse 1, blowing a 30 amp fuse there is crazy.
Especially as it's fused at 25 amps.
Proactive:
A simple way to check Fuel pump health is by measuring current at Fuse 1.
If its 10.5 Amps relax, if it's more then fix it,
if its 20 amps call the fire department.
>Easy to replace in the 700/900 engine bar! Sort of terrible in the 240 engine bay. The factory shop manual says 'pull the gear box' to replace this thing on 240.
You lost me.... engine bar?
Happy new year, Keep well! Bill
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Great photo - Kitty π±!
There is no space to give you a thumbs up. Since I canβt give you a thumbs up any other way here is a double!!
ππ
--
Will I buy another Volvo??? We'll see....
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Hi Bill,
There's a good reason the CPS cable shield isn't grounded at both ends. It's a common misconception with coax applications and not necessarily intuitive. Art and I had a conversation about this here a couple of years ago where he provided a link to an excellent paper on the topic. If both ends of the shield were connected then stray currents may flow through the shield from ECU chasssis ground potential to the bell housing ground potential, thus possibly inducing current in the axial conductors, which is exactly what you're trying to avoid. Any RF hitting the cable gets dissipated by the shield to the chassis at one end of the cable and having two paths to chassis ground would make little or no difference.
--
Dave -still with 940's, prev 740/240/140/120 You'd think I'd have learned by now
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fyi-no hall effect sensor is ever grounded to the engine or elsewhere. the foil coax wrap on 3 is the ground to the ecm. i've found that when that shield is broken, it causes problems. BUT, i've always seen the outer jacket cracked or broken, causing damage to the shield. i've also had non-oe sensors cause problems out of the box, so it's oe or bougicord only, no other brand.
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