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Compression Test Help Needed 200 84

Since it looks like I’ll be rebuilding the head, I thought I’d look at the bottom end of the engine too (B-21FT).

I did a compression test, this time taking compression readings with a "dry" cylinder and a second with a squirt (about a tablespoon)of oil into the cylinder. Results are as follows in psi:

Cylinder No Oil Oil

1 100 130

2 120 120

3 110 120

4 120 130

2-4 are pretty close but #1 seems a bit off. I have heard that the #1 cylinder wears more than the other three but I don’t know if there is too much difference in pressure readings to indicate a rebuild to the block.

How much difference is too much and what other things should I be looking for?

Thanks—I really do appreciate the information.









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    Re: Compression Test Help Needed 200 84

    Another important item in a compression test is a fully charged battery. Slow cranking will give lower readings.

    I often read that you are looking for no more than 10% difference between highest and lowest, but it seems like most older engines are outside that spec aand often not in need of rebuilding.








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      Re: Compression Test Help Needed 200 84

      Peter,

      Great post.

      I've copied it and will file it in my Bently manual. I'll use the instructions when I do my next compression test in the Spring.

      Thanks

      Mike








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    Re: Compression Test Help Needed 200 84

    I sure hope you're not rebuilding the head due to compression loss - there's nothing in those readings pointing to leaky valves.

    Your readings are low, but not bad. Most people do NOT perform compression tests correctly, so you may be able to get some more meaningful numbers.

    1. Unless you're checking for poor starting due to serious low compression when cold, the engine should be at or near normal temperature. With aluminum heads, plugs should be loosened only when cold and then lightly seated to warm it.

    2. Disable the ignition system and

    prop the throttle linkage open <--(common mistake).

    Hint: pull the coil wire and rubber band it to/near the linkage so you won't forget to undo the propping before restarting the engine.

    3. Use a helper, a remote starter button or position the gauge where you can see it while cranking.

    4. Screw compression gauge hose into a cylinder and WATCH the reading on the first stroke. This is closely related to the dynamic pressure when the engine is running and indicates the sealing ability of the RINGS during the compression stroke. It should be at least 75 PSI and somewhere between 75-80% of the final reading.

    Let the engine crank for a total of FOUR strokes, not 3,not 5, not 18. This indicates the ability of the rings to seal during the POWER stroke and the integrity of the valve-to-seat seal. Most people crank until the reading stops rising. This skews the results. You're looking for balance between cylinders, so you have to test each one the same way.

    If you miss the first stroke reading, see the gauge jump the instant the engine spins, or zip past the fourth stroke - release the pressure and retest that cylinder.

    Record the guage reading.

    Rule of thumb; final reading below 100 PSI with normal (non-racing) camshafts, below 5000', on an engine with a compression ratio between 7.5-9.0 to 1, is too low for dependable starting and good economy. (Don't be getting too worried here - your turbo motor is right down at the low end of that range [mid 7s] so it's not so bad).

    I generally record both the first and fourth stroke readings for comparison.

    5. Move the gauge to the next cylinder and repeat.

    6. When one or more low dry readings warrant performing a wet test, use the pump type oil can and be sure to squirt the SAME amount of oil into each cylinder. Crank the engine one or two times before screwing the gauge into a cylinder just oiled. No need to check to first stroke reading in this test. You're looking for the amount of improvement over the fourth stroke reading of the dry test. A 10-15 PSI rise is normal. If you start a wet test, check all cylinders, not just a low one.

    A big jump in readings indicates that the oil is sealing weak rings. Very little change, only where a dry reading was low, would indicate leakage elsewhere...usually valves, but head gasket leakage would give similar results.

    A similar rise between cylinders indicates even wear, and may warrant no further investigation.

    7. Reinstall spark plugs, unjam throttle, reconnect ignition system, check hoses, etc. that you moved while servicing the car, start engine, close hood.

    8. Put away tools, get cold beer or dinner.

    After all that...you may find smaller (or larger) differences between cylinders. The readings you started with indicate good valve sealing and slightly worn compression rings. Unless your 16 year old car is pristine, and the compression loss has really taken its toll in power or gas mileage - you can save yourself a whole lot of money and labour by leaving the guts alone and keeping up with the regular maintenance.

    In other words, don't fix what may not be broken.

    PS for other readers; You cannot perform a "dry" test after doing a "wet" test without putting things back together and running the engine to burn off the oil.









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      Re: Compression Test Help Needed 200 84

      I just post a message about my compression then I saw your replies.

      The question is if I didn't give full throttle during the test does it effects the readings?

      Thanks

      shifo








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        Re: Compression Test Help Needed 200 84

        Since you're measuring how well the cylinder can seal gases (mostly air), allowing the cylinder to fill fully gives the most accurate results.

        The answer to your question; maybe...a little - but it would affect them all the same so, if your readings were good, don't sweat it.








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          Re: Compression Test Help Needed 200 84

          Thank you very much for your reply.I'll keep this in mind.By the way my readings are a lot higher than the regular.Between 195 and 210 psi.And i have a lot of power loss.I just send a message to the board "84-245DL fuel pump suspicious,power loss." If you can check that message I gave all details about my car and I'll appreciate if you give your opinions.

          Shifo








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      Re: Compression Test Help Needed 200 84

      I haven't done a compression test on my 83' turbo yet (haven't needed to), but I was wondering if the lower compression ratio would affect the pressure readings. The turbo engine is only 7.5:1 compression. The car has 193k miles and runs and drives well, but sometimes (usually when cold) blows a bluish\black plume of smoke from the exhaust when shifting (as soon as throttle is closed). Im pretty sure this is the turbo wearing out, and im not too worried beacuse the cat is gutted (oil cant damage plain metal). Will a compression check help deternime if this is worn valve guides or a turbo seal leak? I believe the turbo has around 50-80k miles, and it is non watercooled. This symptom is much less apparent (if ever) when using 20w 50 synthetic oil, instead of 10w 30.

      (car runs and drives well, and still accelarates hard under boost)

      (sometimes when in high vacuum the same smoke plume will appear, such as coasting down with throttle closed)

      Thanks for any tips or advice,

      Zack








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        Re: Compression Test Help Needed 200 84

        Compression ratio, camshaft profile and altitude are the three biggest factors in calculating what the final pressure should be with a tight (<5% leakage) cylinder. Wear lowers it, deposits raise it (by raising compression ratio).

        A compression test will NOT show anything regarding the condition of parts outside of the internal cylinder. Nor will it show the condition of the oil control rings, except for the fact that excessive oil could help seal worn compression rings and indicate normal readings when all rings are worn.

        The oil rings are a possibility in your car but the symptom sounds much more like bad valve stem seals, which also will not be shown by a compression test. A vacuum gauge will find badly worn guides, but servicable guides with bad seals on them tend to read normally. You can unbolt the intake manifold and inspect the intake valve stems for wetness/deposits to be sure if this is it. The seals can be replaced with the cylinder head bolted in place.








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    Re: Compression Test Help Needed 200 84

    My Haynes manual says that 170psi is standard, and 128psi is the minimum. Here's some more information from Haynes:

    "A low compression reading on the first stroke, which doesn't build up during successive strokes, indicates leaking valves or a blown head gasket (a cracked head could also be the cause). Deposits on the undersides of the valve heads can also cause low compression."

    "If the compression increases significantly after the oil is added, the piston rings are definitely worn. If the compression doesn't increase significantly, the leakage is occurring at the valves or head gasket."

    "If one cylinder is about 20% lower than the others, and the engine has a slightly rough idle, a worn exhaust lobe on the camshaft could be the cause."

    Hope this helps.








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      Re: Compression Test Help Needed 200 84

      Never compare numbers from one compression gauge to another. There are three good gauges in my shop, all of which read differently. There are a couple of things people often miss on a compression test. The engine should be warm. Loosen the spark plugs a turn. Put the wires back on and start the engine. Zap it a couple of times, then shut it off and pull the plugs. This is to blow out the little bits of carbon that break off when the plugs are removed. This is the number one cause of inaccurate readings, as those chunks of carbon land under a valve and hold it open. Now remove the plugs, screw the tester in, floor the throttle (this isn't real important on a Volvo, but a car with Webers or something with little air in the manifold it can make a huge difference.) and crank the engine through 4 "puffs" only. If you watch the gauge, it should jump to within probably 80% of its final reading on the first two puffs. Slow rising means poor compression rings. A low reading that jumps up to its max fast is a leaking valve. The wet test will confirm rings, but even a healthy engine will rise some on a wet test. Compare cylinder to cylinder. A 15 psi difference is really not significant, but much more and you are looking at trouble. Look at the whole picture, too. Are the plugs carboned up? Lots of blowby thru the breather? Rougher idle than you expect out of a volvo? All of these are signs.








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        Re: Compression Test Help Needed 200 84

        It looks like we were both answering to the common mistakes of the simple compression test at the same time...and hit on all the same points.








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          Re: Compression Test Help Needed 200 84

          All,

          Thanks for the information--I can really use this! I don't know what I'd do without the BB sometimes.

          I'll let you know how this progresses.

          Best







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