posted by
someone claiming to be Erik
on
Thu Jul 29 16:05 CST 2004 [ RELATED]
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well...after almost forty years the wobbily door hinge pins do not want to part company. tried pounding on the vise, and sitting in the 10,000lb press with heaps of penetrating oil with no luck.
suggestions from the masters?
i'm afraid if i heat it up with a torch the metal will change enough to cancel out the benefit of new pins.
thanks,
-erik
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My 2 door's top pins (driver's side is worse)are worn. With what would one replace the worn pins after pressing the old ones out? 2 door's extra length seem to accelerate this wear. Also, I remember someone mentioning a hole in the hinge for a grease injection, but seem to have no holes in my hinges. Anybody know the hole size in hinges with such capability?
thanks
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Erik, I had really good luck using a light oil and heating the hinges with a propane torch. One side goes in the vice and the other in a crescent wrench or you hit it with a hammer. Whatever it takes to get the thing moving. Dab the oil in the gaps around the pin. After about 10 minutes of adding more oil, keeping it hot, and bashing the thing through its travel arc, you will probably have it moving pretty freely. This technique seems to "boil" out the rust. Be prepared to clean it well and sand blast before attempting to paint.
Doing this, I took all of my door hinges from frozen solid to flopping back on themselves. Havent noticed any ill effects.
Good luck,
Josh
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Erik, I had really good luck using a light oil and heating the hinges with a propane torch. One side goes in the vice and the other in a crescent wrench or you hit it with a hammer. Whatever it takes to get the thing moving. Dab the oil in the gaps around the pin. After about 10 minutes of adding more oil, keeping it hot, and bashing the thing through its travel arc, you will probably have it moving pretty freely. This technique seems to "boil" out the rust. Be prepared to clean it well and sand blast before attempting to paint.
Doing this, I took all of my door hinges from frozen solid to flopping back on themselves. Havent noticed any ill effects.
Good luck,
Josh
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Could be worse... In my XK120 service manual, the first step to even removing a door hing is to remove front wing... that is, take off the fender, which ain't bolted on... its welded and leaded and about 6' long.
If absolute worse comes to worse, have you considered drilling them out? I've never dealt with 122 hinges, so I don't know. Just a though... That's how I did it in teh Jag, and with good results. But it was a simpler design...
-Matt
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-Matt '70 145s, '65 1800s, '66 122s wagon, others inc. '53 XK120 FHC
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posted by
someone claiming to be mario
on
Fri Jul 30 04:10 CST 2004 [ RELATED]
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The Eastwood catalog has a hinge pin removing tool. It looks like specially made c-clamp, it might work.
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posted by
someone claiming to be patrickofmontreal
on
Fri Jul 30 03:35 CST 2004 [ RELATED]
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My partts catalogue shows that the pin comes out, but mine didn't even after it had sheared(that's how long I waited before fixing them)Also I seem to remember seeing some that had a small screw on the hinge body that located the pin, keeping it in place. This screw may have been painted over.
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posted by
someone claiming to be patrickofmontreal
on
Fri Jul 30 03:28 CST 2004 [ RELATED]
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I had to replace the whole hinge assembly, I'm not sure that the pins even come out. Never did manage to pull mine. Hva eyou removed the hinges from the car or are you trying to get the out while the door is still on?. Patrick.
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posted by
someone claiming to be Erik
on
Fri Jul 30 04:31 CST 2004 [ RELATED]
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Have you got the new pins? If not maybe you should look for complete
hinges. But remember, if you use heat, you are NOT heating the NEW pins.
A couple things to remember about using heat:
1. Don't use more than necessary to achieve the desired objective.
The more you heat it above about 500°F, the more you temper (soften) the steel.
2. In using thermal expansion to loosen things, remember it is the temperature
DIFFERENCE that does most of the work (although you do also dehydrate the
hydrated iron oxides [rust] that may reduce their volume). Therefore it is
to your advantage to heat suddenly and act immediately when the part is hot,
before the heat conducts to the inside part (the old pin). If you can have
the hinge in the press with pressure applied, and turn up your torch pretty
hot so you heat it quickly/suddenly, you'll have your best chance of
breaking it loose.
I remember once my grandfather watched from a distance as I worked with a
torch for a couple days trying to get a brake drum off my 1940 Ford pickup,
similar to the arrangement on the 122 but with a much longer tapered section
on the center of the hub. Finally on the third day as I was getting the
torch out again he came out with a teakettle of boiling water and a rag.
He said "Got your hammer?" I protested that I did, but that I had had the
hub almost red hot several times already. He said, "OK, get ready." and
wrapped the rag around the threaded end of the axle and then poured the
boiling water over the end of the hub. As soon as he had poured all the
boiling water over it, he took the rag off and said "OK, HIT it!" I did
and the brake drum popped off. With the boiling water, which has a very
high heat capacity, even though it isn't extremely hot, you heat the hub
suddenly, and for a couple seconds, before the axle inside gets hot, it
is a little bit looser.
--
George Downs, Bartlesville, Oklahoma, Central US
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posted by
someone claiming to be mjamgb
on
Sun Aug 1 10:19 CST 2004 [ RELATED]
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You must have been heating the axle. The axle was swelled but the drum was dissipating the heat and was cooler (therefore it was tighter!) the water on the hub reversed the situation.
If you heat the metal to "cherry red" it will need to be re-tempered. A bucket of motor oil is nice as it tempers the steel without causing the itty-bitty crystals that water tempering would (making it brittle).
The heating is NOT to loosen the rust/stuck part while hot. The heating is to destroy/alter the bond between the pin and the hinge pieces. A propane torch will not get hot enough to anneal the steel (no worries).
The penetrating oil should be a quality product for the purpose (NOT WD-40).
The press should be able to get the job done once the bond has been broken.
Mike!
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As a professional metallurgist I would suggest that you get a good book on
ferrous metallurgy or heat treating of steel. Tempering is a separate operation
normally after quenching, and its purpose is to soften and toughen the steel.
I was heating the hub but not suddenly enough to loosen it from the axle.
With very few exceptions, all solid metals are crystalline but their structures
vary quite widely.
--
George Downs, Bartlesville, Oklahoma, Central US
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posted by
someone claiming to be mjamgb
on
Mon Aug 2 06:50 CST 2004 [ RELATED]
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Yes. You are very correct and I bask in your knowledge ;)
I believe I said it was crystalline.
I agree that the processes go hand in hand, especially for the metal to perform within the intended range of impact and shear loading expected. Quenching too "hard" makes the steel too brittle. I suggested oil as it will yield a tougher product in the first place.
Very few backyard mechanics will be able to perform precision heating and cooling necessary to temper much of anything... best they can do is anneal (remove all tempering) and heat/quench (remove all toughness).
Yes?
I am NOT a professional metalurgist and the training I had in that field was nearly 20 years ago and never applied except to allow me to question whether or not heating something was a good idea!
The water heated the hub "faster?" Still confused by the story a little. Not to worry, however, as I often have mental blocks to complete comprehension (just as the better half!).
Be cool (or tempered),
Mike!
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