Greetings,

I need your advise, please. My new job is 60 miles from where I live. I need a safe and reliable car to commute to work every day. I am considering a 99’ V70 or S70 with plain 5 cyl engine, auto-trans, and keep it for many years. Safety, reliability, cost and comfort are my primary requirements.

Questions:

1. Are those models reliable and can last for many years without major trouble?
Someone told me that transmission in his 850 wagon went at around 120k miles. Does that make sense? I heard of 240 models making 400k and more…
2. Can the basic engine run on a regular or premium only? Costs might be an issue for me.
3. What hwy mileage can I expect from that engine?
4. In your opinion, are there any specific options that I should look to get, e.g., a specific package, model, version, etc.?
5. If you were to define a single most common problem with those models, what would that be and how much does it cost to correct it by a dealer?
6. Is Volvo like BMW where you have plenty of sensors that only specialized dealers can diagnose and maintain for a hefty price?


Thank you for your help.

Peter

I have 3 Volvos

92 740 wagon 100K miles
Repairs: rear engine seal, replaced radiator

94 850 turbo 120K miles
repairs: rear engine seal (under warranty), a/c control

98 R wagon, bought Febuary 2002, no repairs, fixed the rattles (door and hatch adjustments)

No check engine lights
No electrical failures
No drivetrain issues
Fit / finish as good as any car.

I guess it's good the cars don't read Consumer Reports.

I am pleased with all 3 vehicles

Wills

I have always taken Consumer Reports ratings with a large grain of salt - especially their automobile ratings. Why?

1. CR waited a darn long time to test any full sized pickups. The best selling vehicles in this country for years and years and years. I think that CR staff would never buy a pickup themselves. BTW they regularly test Mercedes Benzes, how many of those are sold in this country?

2. CR only takes input for their yearly survey from people who purchased their cars new. They stated a few years ago that the average car lasts 10 years and has 3 owners. I think that their policy eliminates feedback from the majority of drivers. BTW If I dump my car because it is a pig, by definition, I am not supposed to rate a car that I no longer own. Unless I lie. I see a lot of brickboard posts made by used car owners.

4. CR readers often want to save money, and rate economic purchases higher than those that are not. Peanut butter sandwiches are economic, I enjoy a piece of fish or steak once and a while.

3. CR only rates other major items that are less than 5 years old. I haven't been able to rate my 1972 Maytag washer for quite a few years. The matching dryer did crap out two years ago.

I have subscribed to CR since 1972, and I still think that they do a poor job testing cars. If you read their tests, one car will have a stopping distance of 145' and merit a good comment, and the next will stop in 141' and get panned.


--
2 8s & 2 7s 600,000 miles total

just bought a used 99v70 from a volvo dealer. was a leased car from the nearby area.have owned various volvos for the last 17 years, have run them from new upto 190,000 miles with no major problems. this v70 has been the most trouble prone because it is the most monitored ofthe four i have. once you get used to the fact that the "check engine" lite is hooked to a lot of systems that have nothing to do with the engine directly and it is not the end of the world when it comes on, then the car is very reliable and enjoyable. every stray milliamp that doesn't arrive on time at its destination set the lite off and is more anoyance than informative.
i got an extended volvo warranty with the car to 100,000 miles or 6 years from the first purchase. had about 55,000 on it when i got it. dealer has been very goog about taking care of the minor squawks that i found after the sale. they did not inspect the car as was advertised and i found a lot of normal items that neede attention that they had not even bothered to check. hold thier feet to the fire for that "130 point inspection".
would not hestitate to buy another but keep in mind that if this is your first volvo you will be disgusted until you convince yourself the car is not going to fall apart everytime the check eng. lite comes on. keep the oil changed, the radiator full, use regular gas and drive it till the block melts down.
btw, my income is quite low, that is why i stick with volvos.

tucker,

I remember having the CE light go on with chilling frequency until the dealer told me that Volvo had issued a circuit retrofit for the '98 70 series.

That was done on my car in mid-98 and the only time the CE light went on was when I drove away with the cap sitting on the gas pump. After that I always use the hook on the gas door.

Good luck,

Bryan

I live about 100 miles away from my "temporary" consulting gig. I've been driving there for nearly 3 years. I stay over 2-3 nights/week. It isn't worth the wear and tear on my corpus to do it every day, never mind my car. I use the Volvo because I had the Volvo when I started. And, BTW, my household income is fairly high, so annoying failures are mostly annoyances, not financial disasters.

Would I actually RECOMMEND that someone go out and buy a used one for a drive like I do?

No. I'd recommend a Camry or Toyota Avalon. Maybe a Honda Accord, because it's being completely redesigned for 2003 and there are some great deals to be found. Put another way, you can buy a NEW 2002 4-cylinder Accord EX 4-door sedan (which is the next-to-top trim level) and the "street price" according to carsdirect.com is $18560, and you can usually BEAT that price with some legwork, vs. a used SV70 it is no contest IMO.

Q1. Are those models reliable and can last for many years without major trouble? Someone told me that transmission in his 850 wagon went at around 120k miles. Does that make sense? I heard of 240 models making 400k and more…

A1. Ummmmm. If you mean the automagic, that's probably decent mileage for one. It also likes frequent fluid changes. I haven't heard of too many manual trannies exploding, though.

Q2. Can the basic engine run on a regular or premium only? Costs might be an issue for me.

A1. Depends on the motor. Naturally aspirated or turbo? Turbos like premium.

Q3. What hwy mileage can I expect from that engine?

A3. i get around 22-24 mpg. Mostly highway driving, 5-speed Turbo.

Q4. In your opinion, are there any specific options that I should look to get, e.g., a specific package, model, version, etc.?

A4. If you can't be convinced to stay away from Volvo, I would look for the MINIMUM number of options, basically none, because if it isn't there, it can't possibly break.

Q5. If you were to define a single most common problem with those models, what would that be and how much does it cost to correct it by a dealer?

A5. Go to the library and borrow the April "New Car Issue" of Consumer Reports. Look at the "frequency of repair charts". Also appreciate that all SV70s from '98 are on the Consumer Reports Used Cars to Avoid list, as is the '99 AWD, the S80, etc. etc.

Q6. Is Volvo like BMW where you have plenty of sensors that only specialized dealers can diagnose and maintain for a hefty price?

A6. Yes. Except Volvos seem to break more often.

Good Luck!

-Punxsutawney Phil

Phil,

Thanks for the wise advise. It makes a lot of sense.
I test drove a S70 and loved the comfort and the performance. My hope was that
I could get one, drive it forever, pay relatively low insurance premium
(vs. Honda or Toyota) and feel that I am protected by one of best safety
cages on the road. Off course, I am concerned about the high maintenance costs.
Once I had a BMW 528i and spent a lot of money on problems reported by the computer. Now I am pretty sure, the BMW are designed to generate huge revenues for the services. If Volvo is same thing, I know I would start hating it after first service call.

Honda 2003? Well, I just saw some spy pictures. It looks great. The only problem
with a new car is that it looses too much value in first minutes after you
bought it...

Many thanks,

Peter

I used to think that too. However, I've come to believe that if I use Mobil-1 synthetic in my cars, and meticulously maintain them by the book, some POs (Previous Owners, or worse, lessees) may go 36,000 miles without so much as changing the oil. Consequently, at 130,000 miles you may be replacing that big chunk of aluminum under the hood on a car purchased used, but sailing along with the new car. I believe the amount of trouble one has toward the end of a car's life is a function of the kind of care a car receives in it's early years.

Also the margin the dealer makes on a new car is maybe a few hundred bucks. The margin he makes on a used one is thousands. So I've come to the conclusion that It's cheapest to buy a new car, even if it's the bottom of the line, maintain it, and drive it "forever", or at least until the reliability tanks. That seems to be around 200,000 milles these days, at which point the car isn't worth much anyway.

While Volvo has a tremendous reputation for safety, some of that reputation is due to the kind of people who buy Volvos. ie if you're concerned with safety you're more likely to buy a Volvo than a Corvette. For some safety information check http://www.hldi.org/

The Toyota Camry-based Toyota Avalon has similar safety statistics to the Volvo 850-SV70. Again, probably more "mature" drivers.

I was thinking model year 2002 for the Accord. These cars seem to be selling for below the invoice.

I don't dislike my Volvo, it's a blast to drive, but it's certainly not been trouble-free. I'd also tend to shy away from a used BMW or Benz for that kind of driving I'd think one needs low maintainance costs and bulletproof reliability.

-Punxsutawney Phil

http://www.groundhog.org

'98 V70T5M 97k mi.
'01 Honda Odyssey 31k mi.
'88 Honda 3613 Lawn Tractor
'82 Honda Lawnmower
'88 Mercury Colony Park plastic woody wagon kidmobile 180k mi

Thanks for the comments. I will check Honda Accord. You are right; the new model will push the current out of the inventories and great deals may be available.

I found out that you could get a reset tool for the 'check engine' light.
http://www.obd2.com/accessories/data/volvo.htm

Do you use it or prefer to have each alarm diagnosed by a dealer?
The '99 S/V models can be reset without special tools:

http://www.obd2.com/accessories/data/light_reset_volvo.htm

Are Volvos that complicated that alarms need to be diagnosed each time
the light flashes? I wonder if Tacker's tactic of ignoring the light is a safe practice?

My point is that Volvo is not a Formula 1 machine that needs complex computer monitoring. If the fluids are in place, the compression is good and the brakes are in good shape (experienced drivers frequently check those things without waiting for warning), what else would you need to know? 'Less complicated cars' don't have the expensive sensors and, when well taken care of, they last for long years and miles. Expensive cars are equipped with sensors to hike the price and inflate the service revenues. So, perhaps it is not a bad idea to ignore the light (reset it) when all is checked. Does it make
sense?


I know that this forum is loaded with postings about problems with Volvos.
Since you have had some problems with yours, would you be able to give me an idea about what has been the biggest trouble with your V70?

Thanks,
Peter

I found good data on Consumerreport.org. According to that source, 99's S/V70 have major problems with:

- electrical system: rated 1 in scale 1-5. ANY COMMENTS ON THIS, PLEASE?
- power equipment: rated 3
- body integrity: rated 3
- body hardware: rated 3
- fuel, suspension, brakes: all rated 4
- All the rest: rated 5

For comparison, '01(in new cars category) Honda Accord scored 5 in all categories except 4 in 'body integrity'. New Toyota Camry scored all fives.

It looks like Volvos are rather unreliable. It pretty much looks
like Fords's influence ( I leased Fords; they are cheap but have lousy quality). I checked Saab as well. It does not look too good either. GM owns Saab. Looks like a pattern. What a shame. Those cars used to famous in EU for their high quality...

Ford announced the acquisition of Volvo on 1/28/1999. The quality of the 1999 models has absolutely nothing to do with Ford. Since I do not have a 1999 model (I have 2001 V70), I will defer any comments on the CR ratings to others on this board.

As to you other statement, GM had 50% ownership of Saab until 2/2000. It then purchased the remaining 50%. Double check the CR ratings on new Saabs, I believe they are currently rated pretty good. I know for sure that CR considers a used Saab 9-5 a "good bet". Maybe problems exist with the particular Model-Year that you were looking at.

The first true GM-Saab (the new 9-3) is due out later this year. The first true Ford-Volvo will be the new 40-series replacements, which are expected to be introduced around the 2004 calendar year. Until these new Volvo-Saab models are released, I will withhold judgement on the impact of the acquisitions.

Good luck finding a good used car. You appear to be doing some good research. That is a good start.