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HELP on removeing water pump off water bypass tube... and other things 200 '86

posted by  someone claiming to be Dave Pell on  Sat Nov 3 12:07 CST 2001 [RELATED]

I knew something would happen to the waterpump soon.. but the THREE mechanics in the last three monthes all said my waterpump is fine... even if the fan hub rubs the timing mark flange and timing change cover.

Ironically while at the parts store getting oil and filter for my First oil change (3000plus miles on this third hand rig) after quizically noting the higher than usual temps upon getting the parts store.. there's a big puddle of coolant under car.

Actually the water pump maybe still okay. But obviously the gasket going up to the head is severely blown-out.

I can only get an off-brand "after market" pump on the weekend. I may just get the gasket ... but the old pump although turning without resistance seems shorter (causing the rubbing of said parts above. ....)

questions: waterbypass pipe removal_ use wood block and tap the water pump off it??? twist it with pipe wrench??? (dangerous to tube)... etc???

also ?should new waterpump be stiff in turning (as the one I bought

a couple of monthes ago and returned as the mechanics said I didn't need it!!!_)???

I know this is easy task for many of you but would like assistance. thanks







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    Re: HELP on removeing water pump off water bypass tube... and other things 200 '86

    posted by  someone claiming to be Don Foster on  Sat Nov 3 12:44 CST 2001 [RELATED]

    "I may just get the gasket ... but the old pump although turning without resistance seems shorter (causing the rubbing of said parts above. ....)"

    If you're going to the trouble of removing it to replace the gasket and seals, put in a new off-brand.

    "...waterbypass pipe removal.."

    Do you mean the heater pipe that goes back under the exhaust manifold? The pump should pull straight off, leaving the pipe in position.

    "...getting oil and filter for my First oil change..."

    Not Fram, I hope........







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      Fram??? is that bad??? 200 '86

      posted by  someone claiming to be Dave Pell on  Sat Nov 3 13:35 CST 2001 [RELATED]

      matter of fact, they did give me a Fram!! (actually this was the second oil change in the 3000 miles plus as I did have it changed soon after buying it... with a cheaper than usual garage change: 29 dollars or something.... loss leader as the total for oil and filter was about that for me ... and I have to add my labor)

      coolant bypass tube as the manual calls it is giving me a bit of resistance in pulling it towards the front of engine.

      In the morning I finish it up.

      The sudden loss of coolant in the dirt driveway was especially bad as we have a Labrador retriever and he was just about to drink from a fresh coolant added puddle... '''

      also the same parts store that sold me the Fram also said I could drive my rig home no problem if I kept the coolant reservoir cap loose... of course he just didn't want my car staying in his parking lot over the weekend is what he meant. Thus losing more dangerous fluid in my lot... 'course I'd rather have it home too... in order to work on it here.

      I have the less expensive guide which gives some details in photos on how to do the waterpump. It is just old age on the part of the car perhaps and not anything else perhaps that caused the upper gasket to blow.

      I am putting off the oil change til later after I can deal with 2 eight year old boys ... and find time to fix the old car...

      Ironically a friend left her newer ('93 245DL) Volvo in the yard which luckily is my substitute for a day or so. ....Just luck I had another car around.







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        Re: Fram??? is that bad??? 200 '86

        posted by  someone claiming to be Don Foster on  Sat Nov 3 13:46 CST 2001 [RELATED]

        "...they did give me a Fram!"

        Too bad. Someone once called them the "orange kiss of death." In the future try to find Mann filters -- about $4 each or less, and 100 times better than the kiss of death.

        "...coolant bypass tube as the manual calls it is giving me a bit of resistance in pulling it towards the front of engine..."

        Pull harder and twist it a bit.

        Clean all the surfaces and don't be afraid to use a light coating of red RTV on the rubber seals and gaskets. The RTV not only helps seal, particularly if the surfaces are pitted, but helps the square-cut O-ring (used on the pipe) to easily slide into the new pump.

        Review the manual about installing the pump. It goes onto the front of the engine and then is gently pried upward to compress the top "mushroom" O-ring, and then the nuts 'n bolts are snugged down to hold it firmly against the underside surface of the head.

        This is an excellent time to replace the timing belt (and tensioner and three front seals) if the mileage is right.







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          Re: Fram??? is that bad??? 200 '86

          posted by  someone claiming to be Les Lyne on  Sat Nov 3 14:35 CST 2001 [RELATED]

          "Someone once called them the orange kiss of death."

          Someone who's been a bit quite on the ol' BB lately, no?







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            Re: Fram??? is that bad??? eergh.. I HATE spelling errors! 200 '86

            posted by  someone claiming to be Les Lyne on  Sat Nov 3 14:36 CST 2001 [RELATED]

            Not "quite"... quiet! quiet!! QUIET!!!!

            Ok, now I'll be quite quiet.







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              Orange what??? 200 '86

              posted by  someone claiming to be Art Benstein on  Sat Nov 3 14:49 CST 2001 [RELATED]


              Headlight Step Relay from the side, Les.







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                Yikes, that is a secret project! 200 '86

                posted by  someone claiming to be David Hunter on  Sun Nov 4 03:41 CST 2001 [RELATED]

                Art thinks he has me fooled with that picture disguised as an oil filter quality survey. That is a picture of Art's research and development efforts to come up with a solution to the relay bad solder dilema. It is very clear that he intends to have an oil immersion relay encasement system all inside old oil filter cans. Very clever Art.







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                Re: Orange what??? Thanks for the pic! 200 '86

                posted by  someone claiming to be Chris Herbst on  Sun Nov 4 03:24 CST 2001 [RELATED]

                Great pic, art. I never cut apart a Fram for myself, although I figured I'd find something similar.

                I DID cut apart a Bosch filter. Looked better than the Fram, I can tell you that much.







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                Re: Orange what??? 200 '86

                posted by  someone claiming to be Les Lyne on  Sat Nov 3 15:06 CST 2001 [RELATED]

                I gotta tell you again, Art... your pix are over the top... pure greatness.

                Check out WDM Q#8... to be posted soon.







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                Re: Orange what??? 200 '86

                posted by  someone claiming to be charles on  Sat Nov 3 14:53 CST 2001 [RELATED]

                Are Fram filters really that bad? In a moment of weakness I recently put Fram filters on my volvos bec I couldn't find Mann filters. Should I stay awake at night with the Fram on my beloved volvo?







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                  Re: Orange what??? 200 '86

                  posted by  someone claiming to be Kane on  Sat Nov 3 15:46 CST 2001 [RELATED]

                  Yes they are.

                  Besides a lack of filtering area, and the concern that they use cardboard for the end cap, that so called check valve (that flap of thin steel) is absolutely useless.

                  I left the oil filters out of the sevaral family cars's a couple weekends ago, outlet side down on a newspaper. After a day, the Fram out of my sister's car was nearly drained dry, where as the OEM out of my '91 was still full. Rechecking last week, the Fram still leaked on the new sheet of newspaper, whereas the OEM just had a few drops underneath.

                  The saddest thing of it all is that Fram's aren't any cheaper than other brands. Still over $3 at Walmart and the likes.

                  If height allows and you're in a pinch, go with a Motorcraft FL-1A. If height doesn't allow, the FL-300. AC Delco equivilents of these also work, but the Motorcraft has more area and uses synthetic media. Both of these can be had under $3.

                  -- Kane







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                    Re: Orange what??? 200 '86

                    posted by  someone claiming to be Chris Herbst on  Sun Nov 4 03:23 CST 2001 [RELATED]

                    That's for sure... I have to stick a nail in the drainback valve to get the oil out of my filters. I usually let them drain into the center hole and dump them out. Have to do it four or five times over ten minutes or so just to get the oil out. The Frams just dribble right out in a short period of time.

                    I second the Motorcraft filters if you can't snag the real thing. Probably one of the best alternatives, and certainly cost effective too. I usually use the FL300 if I need to grab that brand. It's listed for 6-cyl Audi engines, so it probably gives the B230 enough oil filtering too (since the Audi is pretty sophisticated and more fragile).







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                    Re: Orange what??? 200 '86

                    posted by  someone claiming to be charles thayer on  Sat Nov 3 16:04 CST 2001 [RELATED]

                    I guess what I was getting at - would keeping the Fram filter on my volvos for the next 2000 miles have that great of a detrimental effect on my "fleet". Of course after I bought and installed the fram filters I found a local source for the man filters. However, being on a very tight budget I can't afford to change the filter and oil that soon and I certainly can't afford to destroy my cars. If I do change the Fram to a Mann do I really need to replace the oil as well even it is only 60 miles old?







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                      Re: Orange what??? 200 '86

                      posted by  someone claiming to be Art Benstein on  Sat Nov 3 16:37 CST 2001 [RELATED]

                      "If I do change the Fram to a Mann do I really need to replace the oil as well even it is only 60 miles old? "

                      Changing the filter only is pretty easy -- no getting under the car. You won't be missing much oil after pulling off the orange one;-) Be nice if Mann sprayed that grip handle on the end of theirs.







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                      Re: Orange what??? 200 '86

                      posted by  someone claiming to be Art Benstein on  Sat Nov 3 16:29 CST 2001 [RELATED]

                      Charles, I can offer my two cents, but you'll want to hear from more than just me on oil and filter politics.

                      I just switched to Mann at the next interval after getting a flat of 10. Was using Purolator, found at a chain auto parts store, which actually cost more than Mann delivered.

                      Was using Fram before Volvo days until looking at some amateur research that influenced me to look for an alternative.







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                    Re: Orange what??? 200 '86

                    posted by  someone claiming to be Art Benstein on  Sat Nov 3 16:00 CST 2001 [RELATED]

                    Got to give them credit for squeezing every penny out of their manufacturing cost while still maintaining the appearance of fit, form and function. Given they are about the same price as the Mann, the profit must be way higher.







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                  Re: Orange what??? 200 '86

                  posted by  someone claiming to be carl krall on  Sat Nov 3 15:28 CST 2001 [RELATED]

                  Staying awake at night won't help anything, but using a Mann will. Or practically anything else.

                  Every time you start the car with a Fram in place you're accelerating the wear on your engine while it waits for the oil pressure to come up. That extra second or two is deleting miles from your engine life. So while you're up anyway, tossing and turning, get on ebay and look for some Manns. I get them delivered that way, and cheaper than they are at the dealer.






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